County Council - Wednesday 19 February 2025, 10:00am - Gloucestershire County Council Webcasting

County Council
Wednesday, 19th February 2025 at 10:00am 

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  8. Cllr Lynden Stowe
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  12. Cllr Stephen Davies
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  14. Cllr Lisa Spivey
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  35. Cllr Paul McLain
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  37. Cllr David Gray
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  45. Cllr Brian Tipper
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  47. Cllr Colin Hay
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  53. Cllr John Bloxsom
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  55. Cllr John Bloxsom
  56. Cllr Wendy Thomas
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  60. Cllr Jeremy Hilton
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  66. Cllr Steve Robinson
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  76. Cllr Lynden Stowe
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  78. Cllr Chloe Turner
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  80. Cllr Gill Moseley
  81. Chair
  82. Cllr John Bloxsom
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  86. Cllr Jeremy Hilton
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  88. Cllr Jeremy Hilton
  89. Cllr Jeremy Hilton
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  91. Cllr Ben Evans
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  93. Cllr Ben Evans
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  95. Cllr Ben Evans
  96. Cllr Emma Nelson
  97. Cllr Tim Harman
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  99. Cllr Cate Cody
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  101. Cllr Joe Harris
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  104. Cllr Andrew Gravells
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  106. Cllr Bernard Fisher
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  108. Cllr Colin Hay
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  110. Cllr Alan Preest
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  48. Cllr Stephen Davies
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  50. Cllr Colin Hay
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  52. Cllr Colin Hay
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  54. Cllr Colin Hay
  55. Cllr Lynden Stowe
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  57. Cllr David Willingham
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  59. Cllr Stephen Davies
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  61. Cllr David Brown
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  65. Cllr Alex Hegenbarth
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  67. Cllr Alex Hegenbarth
  68. Cllr Stephen Davies
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  70. Cllr Alex Hegenbarth
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  74. Cllr Linda Cohen
  75. Cllr David Gray
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  79. Cllr Roger Whyborn
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  82. Cllr Dave Norman
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  86. Cllr Dave Norman
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  90. Cllr Stephen Davies
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  92. Cllr Paul Hodgkinson
  93. Cllr David Gray
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  96. Cllr David Gray
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Chair - 0:01:44
Thank you.
Good morning, everybody.
Chair - 0:02:12
Welcome to Gloucestershire County Council, Wednesday, the 19th of February, 2025.
First of all, I'd like to say a few words.
May we find wisdom to carry out our duties, humanity to listen to all, the courage to
do what is right, and the generosity to treat each other with respect.
Amen.
Thank you.

1 Apologies for absence

First of all, item one, apologies for absence.
Do we have any apologies for absence?
Councillor Hays
Read them out.
I haven't got, I'm asking are there any apologies for absence?
Rebecca Halifax.
Rebecca Halifax.
Thank you.
Any others?

2 Minutes

No.
Thank you.
Minutes of the previous meeting, item 2.
Our members happy for me to sign the minutes.
Yes, we're all okay?
Thank you.
Item three, declarations of interest.

3 Declarations of Interest

Have we signed a book or any declarations members wish

4 Announcements

to announce. No. Okay. Thank you. Moving on to announcements. Peer challenge. The LGA
peer challenge team returned to review and visit on the 15th and 16th of January of this
year. The feedback from the team has been very positive, highlighting the progress that
we have made since their last visit and the commitment and dedication of the staff.
I want to thank everyone who has been involved in the visit, organizing the sessions and
contributing to the discussions.
And I think this is well received by everyone.
Moving on, New Year's Honours announcements for Gloucestershire.
I'd like to congratulate the people living in Gloucestershire who received awards as
part of the New Year's honours. The list has been emailed to all councillors. I think it
went out on New Year's Eve, so congratulations to everyone who received an award. Thank you.
And finally, I'm on announcements to be a councillor event. The council will be hosting
an event for any potential election candidates on the 4th of March at 6pm. Further details

5 Public Questions

will follow. Thank you. With that I'll move to item 5, public questions.
I'd like to thank members of the public for their questions. The questions and answers
will be taken as read. Supplementary questions must relate to the original question and answer.
We have 30 minutes allowed for this item and I am aware that though we have 71 actual questions
So I will endeavor to ask members of the public, do appreciate coming in to ask the question,
but if you could be succinct with your question so that we can get through as many as possible.
Thank you.
With that, I'll move on to question two.
Is it question two?
Question three is the first one.
Question three, David Redwell.
David, do you have a supplementary?
The Press.
So my question on devolution is simple.
Public - 0:06:28
If we keep delaying, we're in danger of losing U .K. government money to this county.
What progress is being made to move forward quickly
and getting the submission on the end of March and November
to UK governments for the devolved settlement
for Gloucestershire and also joining either the West
of England or a West country based combined authority?
Thank you.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:06:56
Right.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:06:59
Thank you for your question.
And I share your frustration at the delay.
Unlike some in this room, I was keen that we should be
in the first tranche and we would have got to
combined authority a year earlier,
but the minister didn't agree with me,
so we now will have elections in May,
which I look forward to,
and then be a year later getting to unitary.
As part of that though, in answer to your question,
we are working, we have work streams across
all seven councils involved in this,
which include the deciding what we will put
in the letter in March, which will actually be
an outline of proposals available,
and then what we will put as a confirmed position in November.
So, yes, that work is on track and we expect to hit those deadlines.
You will probably be interested to know there's a whole host of other work,
including a discussion on what is the right combined authority
that we might look towards joining.
That's a complicated, multifaceted question,
with many people having individual views on where that should end.
My personal view is we are at an information gathering stage
to understand what our options are and we'll work on that over the next coming months.
But thank you.
Thank you for that, Lida.
Question 4.
Chair - 0:08:09
David, do you have a supplementary to question 4?
Public - 0:08:19
I suppose on question 4, 5 and 6, I suppose the next point of this is really about what
account of the transport network that this council looks after with a number
of bus services at Clost border into South Gloucestershire, a large number of
coach services which are registered from Cheltenham and Gloucester that go to
Bristol and Bath and also the rail networks. We only have one bus service to
Hereford and no bus services to Worcester apart from one from Chuxbury.
What account is being taken because metro mayors are in charge of?
Transport authorities and I do note that
West Gloucester and East are shall be very small for transport powers
They're not big enough to control bus services and train services
So what accounts are being taken of the transport network by the council?
Before us all going forward because that's one of the criteria was being told by Heidi Alexander on Saturday
Chair - 0:09:23
Thank you again for that question.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:09:24
And yes, part of the analysis we've done,
and we're at the stage at the moment,
we have numbers from a couple of years back
on where people travel to work.
We haven't done the analysis of how they get there at this point,
but we do have statistics that tell us
that somewhere over 80 % of people actually stay within county,
but of those that move out of county,
the higher number go towards Bristol.
And that's an important piece of information
that we will put into the decision -making that we make,
because you're absolutely right, one of those powers of a combined authority, which, to
be honest, I think we all could be excited about, is that ability to coordinate our transport
infrastructure, both buses and rail.
Thank you for that.
Chair - 0:10:07
You said, David, you have a supplementary question, seven?
No, that's on points now.
Points now on devolution sharing.
Thank you.
Next I have question 10 from Adrian Hannes.
Adrian, if you would like to come and ask your question, please.
Public - 0:10:35
Yes, I would just like to know what call sortation had taken place on bus services.
Thank you.
Leader.
Chair - 0:10:42
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:10:42
So the question was actually about the BSIP funding,
which we are going to produce the cabinet paper for,
ahead of cabinet on March the 3rd.
We do constantly consult across on bus services.
I'm not sure, and I could get the answer to you,
what we've done specifically about the spending of this BSIP money.
And do you have Adrian as supplementary to question 11?
Chair - 0:11:04
Again, it's just what call tations are taking place for the bus
Public - 0:11:10
stations and that bus roll well.
Chair - 0:11:18
So without telling you what's in the BSIP because we haven't finalized
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:11:19
that,
I know that we have a discussion in there about what we will do to enhance existing
bus stations at different stages of the plan. Thank you.
Thank you for that Adrian.
Chair - 0:11:33
Moving on question 13 Gary Bird.
Gary is Gary here?
Public - 0:11:47
Chair - 0:11:57
Okay, yeah, okay. So David you're gonna ask Gary's supplementaries.
Public - 0:12:09
As you can see, Gary has partially cited and our concerns are around
Public - 0:12:15
the transport hub
which is now the major coach station and will be from April for all National Express in
Cheltenham.
And I just wonder, and I suppose we're all wondering,
about what equality's impact assessments have been done
on that site, because we're extremely concerned
that there's no taxi rank there at present.
So it's impossible to join coaches from a taxi.
And also, we're told by stagecoach, Chris Hansen,
I'll name him, that he would put the X -96, X -94,
into that coach station in the evenings and at night
and on Sundays, and it's a discussion to be had,
because the alternative access for me in a wheelchair,
but Gary in particular, is a dark lit subway
down to the main road, under a subway,
which I welcome Stephen or Philip or anybody,
or where's Jason Humm?
Jason Humm to go and have a look at
to see how safe it is for women and girls,
disabled people carrying luggage.
We do need to resolve this.
I am very proud of that coach station, as David Gray knows,
But we haven't finished it and that is the big issue
So can we have a look at the equalities issues and can we have a look at making sure blind and disabled people?
Having to join coaches and particularly women and girls and people with luggage
Can actually get coaching coaches to connect with buses because more buses are going from I was caught now
Which we welcome National Express hub in this part of the West Country. Well done David for getting all in there
I'm Matthew Parker, but we need now to get the buses connected to it
As I said last night, we desperately need a taxi rank and local bus K to stop.
What progress?
That's really what it is.
Chair - 0:14:00
Thank you again for the question.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:14:02
It's a fair challenge.
I will take that.
Just make sure I heard it correctly.
One is taxis and the other is general access for the disabled.
I will take those away and make sure we get back to you.
Thank you for that.
Chair - 0:14:20
And just Gary have a supplementary David to question 14
Thing then with the B SIP is just to ask and I know I appreciate UK
Public - 0:14:33
government want the money spent quickly
and that's the DFT and heard Alexander, but
What qualities impact assessments and detail can we get done between now and publishing that report?
I suppose to make sure at least we take a counter
inclusive Gloucestershire
disabled people and
blind people when we go to count cabinet on the third
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:15:00
Thank you, David. And as you know in all cabinet papers, there is a
Consideration of those I will make sure that we give that proper attention
It doesn't become a tick box and how we spend that basic money. Thank you very much, Edith
Thank you and
Public - 0:15:13
Chair - 0:15:15
Does Gary have a supplementary for question 15?
Public - 0:15:37
So I suppose on that one, it's really just about bus priority and taxes, but I think
that might have been answered, to be honest.
Leader, no?
Chair - 0:15:49
Are we moving on, David, to your own questions?
Question 17, do you have a supplementary?
I suppose the only other thing is if, to both the leader and
Public - 0:16:06
Chief Executive, as we haven't got a Gloucestershire bus users
forum, which is very good, and Philip chairs very well,
all the operators do, can we just make sure that there's
some consultation with the user groups in the county as soon
as that report is available so we can go out and the user
groups, which are about 10 in Gloucestershire,
from Witten under edge to Stroud to Cheltenham to Newant
in the forest to Syrins, Cesta.
We do have a large number of bus user groups
which I talk to both in Gloucester and South Gloucestershire.
Can we just make sure that that paper's available
so they can see the changes to their bus routes?
Because we do try and coordinate our efforts
in coming back to Councilor Robinson.
The forums work very, very well,
compliments the Council.
Chair - 0:16:53
Yeah, kick over the question please.
Public - 0:16:56
Thank you.
Chair - 0:16:58
Yeah, so obviously the papers cabinet
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:17:00
will be published on the website,
But I don't think that's adequate for making sure that they know they've been published
So we'll make sure we contact them
Or the the use groups we're aware of ahead of that because you're right the time in between our March 5th
It won't allow us to bring people together for meeting
Public - 0:17:18
Thank you very much. Okay. Do you have a supplementary to 18?
Chair - 0:17:20
Yes, I do
Public - 0:17:24
Are there any proposals for I think there are proposals already, but do you have a date for?
Installation of the real -time information system in Stroud bus station
Transport hub. I have to be careful here
Chair - 0:17:39
I was told yesterday that it's ongoing the work on Mary walks is happening at the moment
Public - 0:17:41
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:17:42
But I can't give you a complete over anything be finished
Supplementary to 19 I
Chair - 0:17:49
Suppose 19 is about after the election. I'll be very clear in in both Wecker and here both parts of Gloucestershire
but all I would ask would the new administration whoever that is both talk
about the cross -border services particularly the the strout to Yeats
Public - 0:18:15
corridor through Wotton under edge Charfield Whitmore and across the county
that's an important issue to residents both sides of the county of Gloucestershire
say it's for its historic counties two counties but one historic county and
We just talked about some of my career. So please can I ask that's kept on the agenda?
So after the election that we don't
New site, I understand South Gloucester councils now taking control of its own bus budget from Weka something brand new
So that might be helpful in our conversations on cross -border services with Weka support
But it's jointly now rather than just Weka doing on the road
leader
Councilor Davis. Yeah one thing we know about the elections in May is
Chair - 0:18:55
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:18:56
that there will be a new mayor of Weka because the existing one
Is not be standing and I think and hope that that will remove any roadblock and whatever our elections tell us
I think there is a
Fairly unanimous view around this council that we would like to enter into those discussions to try and improve that bus route and that we have
Been frustrated by our inability to do so. So I hope that we will get a move forward
I've spoke to at least one of the candidates but didn't raise this issue, but we'll do next time
Thank you. David, do you have a supplementary to 21?
Chair - 0:19:27
22. I suppose on 22, yes. We mentioned Arles Court connectivity. First
Great Western Railways, first group who approached me
with regards to trying to get a meeting between
Stagecoach, we're hoping Philip was going to share
Public - 0:19:56
this, Stagecoach, go ahead, Great Western Network
Rail, National Express and the county to find, they
want to look at connectivity between the
railway station, Arlescourt Transport Hub and the
centre of town and towards Gloucester because there is
a flow they have both for passengers when trains
don't run but also people wanted to go between those various points and they
were asking for review and a Glocia Rail community rail partnership which
I'm also part of would welcome that. I wonder if that can be done, may have to be
after the new council now but a discussion about Cheltenham's
connectivity and incidentally the MP raised it with me as well the other night
Max so if that could happen I'd be very grateful. I was looking for that but
There we are. Thank you
leader, please
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:20:45
I'll look into that. There's no reason why officers can't have those conversations while we're in
David 23 do you have a supplementary?
Chair - 0:20:54
Chair - 0:21:15
Public - 0:21:18
I suppose on that one there is an issue about, well there's a number of points there, but
the question is I think about tackling and reporting damage and shelters.
I mean there's a very good service actually that the director provides for bus stop maintenance
in this county, but we still get situations where we've got bus stops and infrastructure
where we have out -of -date timetables.
Le Campton's one of them on the air on, Oxford Bus Company.
I wonder if we could look at just making sure that, I don't know whether that's the county
provides all that together, or whether that's go -ahead Oxford Bus as well as Stagecoach,
but if we could just have a look at that.
And the ongoing issue, which is dear to my heart and I'm sure dear to Chris Nelson's
heart, is the graffiti is still appearing on bus shelters, particularly more so now
in Gloucester and Stroud since we got an award in Cheltenham to
Thankfully try and deal with the graffiti artists or criminal damage as I call it
But I wonder if that can be picked up. Thank you. Thank you
Chair - 0:22:17
leader of the council
Yeah, I think I share your view on that one and it's one of those
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:22:22
things which is
Self -inflicted by our society and creates us cost and seems unnecessary, but we will look into it. Thank you
Thank you for that, David.
Chair - 0:22:34
Next I have question 24, Andrew Vaughan.
Andrew, would you like to come and ask your supplementary, please?
Yes, good morning.
Interest of time.
Public - 0:22:44
I'm sure none of you have had the misfortune of having 30 trees, 30 -metre tall, falling
on your gardens and 100 trees across a main road of 300 metres.
That was the experience that I had back in the 7th of December and my other colleagues and other residents
When the trees fell 30 meter trees fell on our houses
My question and also the fact that I had to spend three hours with ambulance and fire
The fire services lifting someone over a hedge because they've broken their back from one of those trees
My question is and has been related to those and the felling of the remaining trees that
that there's still around probably four or 500 trees
still remain along the street.
The response that I got was prompt action.
Here we are still at the end of February,
or near to the end of February.
No action has yet been taken.
Can't see any upcoming action either.
The next storm that we may see,
which we all know what climate change is
in the storms that we're seeing
in the aggression of those trees,
we saw back on the 24th, 25th of January,
Three more trees full
Fortunately not onto the road but onto the farmers field
Prompt action isn't good enough i need, urgent action for those remaining trees to come down and i'm talking about by the end of this month or
the
liability will fall
To, to us generally that, we could have done something about it and we've taken three months to get the remaining trees down
Thank you for that
Chair - 0:24:25
Councillor Morris, no, sorry leader
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:24:29
So, yes, I understand frustration and you understand the restrictions that we can't just go and cut other people's trees down
In our responses, you'll see we are engaged positively with the landowner
But I will follow up to make sure that's treated with urgency because I completely agree with you
We need to get a resolution and the process
As you probably understand is if we do not get cooperation we can take other action, but at this point we are positive
That's fine. Another tree comes down
It's going to go across that highway. Okay, if it comes from the west
Public - 0:24:57
it's going down onto the road. Okay, it's clear
It's an urgent matter. It isn't prompt action. It is urgent
Thank you, thank you mr. Vaughn and councils Julie noted
Chair - 0:25:09
Got question 25 Paul Clark, mr. Clark here
Public - 0:25:21
It is going to be similar to what's just been said, but my original question was about what
powers the GCC have with regard to these trees, whether they can actually consider and issue
some kind of enforcement order.
The response I've had wasn't at all helpful, unfortunately, because it doesn't actually
answer my question.
I am deeply concerned that someone was in a car which a tree fell on and the lady only
got help from the police and a man was very seriously injured and every one of us who
lives on the hill there are really, really concerned that if the wind direction is the
wrong as it was before, we can have another whole load of trees come down and somebody
could actually be killed.
I'm not sure what the responsibility of highways would be then I fear that maybe
GCC could find themselves being held liable
Because the lack of urgent action here is deeply worrying
Chair - 0:26:32
Thank you, mr. Clark. Oh are we is there not the possibility of taking some kind of further action rather than just some
Public - 0:26:38
Two -and -a -half month long process which seems to have no end to it at all
Thank You mr. Clark, thank you for coming today to raise the question
Chair - 0:26:46
leader of the council councillor Davis
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:26:50
Thank you for your question. And I don't underestimate the seriousness of this
I believe I know what the powers are
But can I confirm true in writing what they are and at the same time concern where confirm where we think we are in?
That process and when we will execute what powers we do have
But as I said earlier while we can engage with landowner and they are engaging positively that may be the quickest way forward
But I will confirm back to you separately because I don't want to underestimate the
seriousness of it.
Thank you.
Chair - 0:27:20
Question 26, Richard Pinner.
Is Richard here?
No.
Next, I have Rosa Cal.
Rosa?
No.
Then question 32, David.
David Richwell.
David, do you have a supplementary to question 32?
We were pleased with this actually.
It's a simple question.
Public - 0:27:48
Service N is the Cheltenham Gloucester University Service funded by the Council and the University
of Gloucestershire.
It's recently been changed to go into the railway station to make better connectivity
at Cheltenham each way.
But there's a hub at the Tesco site on Chuxbury Road where this service meets
with the services coming in from Chuxbury, 42, 43 all Stageco services.
But we've got no bus stops at Tesco so people can interchange so they have to
then go another mile into the town centre. I wonder if the council could
look at when they agree changes in bus routes and they part fund that the bus
stops are reviewed at the same time to make sure that if there is new routes
We can put some bus stops even if they're temporary ones so people can change it such interchanges of Tesco in
Cheltenham Spa, thank you
Thank you, David leader of the council
Chair - 0:28:47
Thank you. Thank you. And thank you for your kind words about the
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:28:48
improvement in the bus service
And I recognize that that may have created a new
Challenge and I will take that away and get back to you as to what we can do about it
Chair - 0:29:02
Thank you next on my list I have question 41 James Joyce, it's James here
Thank you, James.
If you'd like to ask your supplementary question, please.
Yeah, thank you.
Public - 0:29:19
As you said, routine maintenance budget is used to repair all safety defects, and therefore
when I asked how much was spent on potholes, you couldn't actually break it out.
I fully understand that.
however
Looking into it further looking into it. I thought I came across something called a highways local money
Which I gather is used by
Councillors, so I was wondering if you could work out how much of that had been spent in the area of Mitchell Dean
Thank you
Chair - 0:29:52
Cheers councillor Davis and highways local actually covers a whole
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:29:53
host of things
I know I've used mine for footpath repairs pavements potholes
We serve seeing contributed to other projects
So I think it's very difficult to extract from that that unless you do it on each individual
Highway manager per year as to how much of any highways but local money was spent on potholes. Sorry not to be more helpful
Chair - 0:30:18
So I so I get what we can't work out the figure thank you
Public - 0:30:20
Thank you for the supplementary question. Thank you for coming in
Chair - 0:30:24
today
Question 48 I've got next. Julian Tuck. Julian, if you'd like to come and ask your supplementary question to question 48, please.
Public - 0:30:38
Thank you. I thank Councillor Davis for his response, but as he knows, for such a scheme, you would expect to use one TRO rather than two.
The process clearly didn't go well, which led to the squandering of over a quarter of a million pounds of taxpayers' money.
Roughly how many potholes could have been fixed using over a quarter of a million pounds that was squandered
Leader of the council council Davis, I think from the last question
Chair - 0:31:05
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:31:05
we've established it's difficult to do the price per pothole calculation, but
The thing about zone 15 if we got it wrong when we first did it and it appears we didn't we are right to make
That correction. Yes, it is expensive
But I think you should always make the right decision and follow that up and sometimes that does have financial consequences
Chair - 0:31:31
Thank you and you have question 48 Julian at 49. Sorry. Do you do?
Once again, thank cancer Davis for his response
But I would suggest that he's unwilling to address the point of the question or the facts that lie behind it
Public - 0:31:45
For years in our most important and pretty historic locations, GCC has been replacing
paving stones with ugly asphalt cow pads.
When is GCC going to stop this practice and make good all the damage that has been done
over a number of years by reinstating paving stones and removing asphalt?
Leader of the Council.
So I think we have good news on this one.
Chair - 0:32:11
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:32:11
First off, on those that are already there,
we have an allocated budget to go and fix and replace them,
and that is the right policy.
Going forward, there will always be emergency occasions
where we will put down a Tarmac solution in the short term,
but we also now have a process to make sure
that they are logged and we go back and fix them
and restore them to the right level of quality
at a later date.
So I think we have changed our policy in this area.
So yes, we recognize that we didn't do it in the past,
but we have a plan to correct that,
And we have a plan to make sure we don't do it again in future, but there will be occasions
Where in an emergency where materials are not available. We do have a short -term
Ugly fix. Thank you
Thank you, and thank you for your supplement chairs
Chair - 0:32:54
Next I have question 61 Adrian Alderman Adrian. Would you like to ask a supplementary question, please?
Thank you, Chair.
Question 61.
Public - 0:33:13
How long is this project continuing, please?
And I see that we still only got eight sites in Stroud.
What's the intended number for EV charging sites at the end of this, please?
Thank you.
Councillor Gray.
Chair - 0:33:35
Thank you for turning up and giving me a supplementary question.
Cllr David Gray - 0:33:38
All that work that I put into the previous questions that nobody turned up.
Finally I get to answer a question so thank you very much.
Yes, it is unfortunate that Stroud, we only have I think eight at the moment.
In terms of the next stage of the rollout, Stroud is a particular focus so there are
many sites in Stroud that have been selected.
The reason we only have eight is because the good residents of Stroud quite correctly are
very passionate about their streets.
So we have put schemes out there,
but the feedback when we've consulted,
and it's a very important part of the process
to consult with local people when we're going to
put these on -street charges out there.
The feedback was that these were,
for one reason or another, not the right places.
So we listened to residents and decided to
follow their advice and move on to other locations.
We're just about to launch the next stage,
so -called Levi funding for a tender for a further stage of implementing electric charging
points across the county.
So we hope that that will help us to accelerate the rate of roll -out.
And as I say, Stroud I think will be one of the areas that we will focus on in terms of
additional charges.
Thank you.
Chair - 0:34:57
And I see Adrian, you have a, you want a supplementary to question 62.
Well, I'm just conscious of time chair, so I do have a question supplementary to
65 if I could just get that one in place, okay
And this is about bus fires
Public - 0:35:14
we seem to have a spate of them in the county and
Despite the
Answer that's given. I think it's an incredibly serious matter
So I've researched this and there are three fires on average per month across the country
That seems to be an incredibly large number and yet I see that there's nothing in the upcoming bus bill
about ensuring that there is greater degree of safety applied to
Buses that carry our elderly our children to and from school
So I would ask if the County Council would implore the MPs in the county to
ask the government to include better safety record or sorry better safety
standards in the new bus bill. Thank you chair.
Okay. Leader of the council, Councillor Dabas.
Chair - 0:36:10
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:36:11
Thank you for that question and you know I'm sure as you do in your
supplementary acknowledge we have no powers in this area but if you wanted to
me some words you want me to say to our MPs we I would be happy actually to do
that I share your concern that bus safety is an issue as you acknowledge
it's not one we have direct control over but I'm happy to voice those concerns
thank you for that I am aware that I've been made aware that Richard Lawler's
Chair - 0:36:38
here and I am going to extend so Richard Lawler can ask his supplementary
questions to 45 46 or 47 Richard so I have a follow -up question to 46 good
Public - 0:36:54
morning councillors Swinton village and Presbury have a significant number of
elderly residents many of whom rely on walking aids and feel trapped in their
homes due to uneven footpaths given the maintenance budgets are allocated on a
needs -led basis rather than by area how does the council ensure that the needs
of vulnerable residents are properly accounted for.
Is there a specific process for prioritising footpath repairs in areas with a high proportion
of elderly or disabled residents and if not, would the Council consider introducing one?
Thank you for that, Richard.
Chair - 0:37:33
I will ask the leader of the Council, Councillor Davies.
Thank you for that question.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:37:36
Actually you are in an area that I have spent some time looking at because I am worried
about the state of payments and you identify the exact issue which is where
do we prioritize because we do not have unlimited budgets where do we prioritize
to fix payments I know we have work on measuring the quality I'm not sure we've
laid that against the age profile of areas and whether we can even do that
but can I take that away as an action and get back to you as to whether we can
improve the targeting of where we do spend always finite resources in terms
of payment and maintenance. Thank you.
Thank you. Richard, do you have another second?
Chair - 0:38:17
I have a follow up to question 47. Thank you.
Public - 0:38:21
Residents have raised concerns with me about children struggling to cross safely, often
having to turn back multiple times due to cars approaching too quickly. This is clearly
a worrying situation. The parish council has previously discussed this issue as agenda
item 150 on the 17th of February and reports were received from the borough councillors,
however the county councillor wasn't present. The police and road safety officer has acknowledged
the problem and a recent observation exercise with Cheltenham borough councillors recorded
20 cars, 11 of which were speeding. One immediate step the council could take is deploying a
battery -powered speed sign a vast or acid to at this location to temporarily improve road safety and
Encourage drivers to slow down would the council consider this as an initial measure while exploring longer -term solutions
Thank you for that Peter the council councillor Davis
Chair - 0:39:20
Cllr Stephen Davies - 0:39:21
I mean the simple answer is probably yes because we've done it in a lot of other areas where that has been part of our
speed management plan is to start with,
and it's two things, one is a camera that notifies people
they're speeding but also collects data
which then helps understand what we need to do
about the longer term speeding.
I need to understand the area as to why we haven't done that
and how we could do that but let's take that offline.
We have run a scheme to provide those.
Thank you for that question Richard
and thank you members of the public
Chair - 0:39:51
for your supplementary questions today.
With that, item 6, corporate parenting, can I invite Councillor Paul McLean to present

6 Corporate Parenting

the report?
Councillor McLean.
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr Paul McLain - 0:40:06
I mean, it's been an extremely busy and positive few months for corporate parenting since I
gave my last report.
As colleagues will see in the report in front of you on 3 .1, we have had Ofsted in carrying
out a focused inspection of our care lever service they were in last month.
The letter will be published on Friday the 21st.
Coincidentally, that's National Care Day.
And I am really looking forward to taking the findings to corporate parenting group
to scrutiny committee and in due course to full council.
At this stage I won't say more, but I will put on record, if I may, through you, Chair,
my thanks to all the teams, our ambassadors,
and our care leavers who were involved.
I would also like to thank the Stroud care leaver
team for the very warm welcome that they gave me
when they allowed me to sit in on their management meeting
and indeed their secret center just before Christmas.
You will recall, Chair, that, as I mentioned
in my previous report, the PAs from that team
were nominated for a national award.
So it was really quite inspiring to hear from them and understand
what they're doing.
A spectacular team staying on the subject of care leavers.
I would draw colleagues attention to the bright spot
survey as mentioned in three point three of the report which
has had the highest engagement uptake to date and will we we
will be reporting back the details later this year.
I'd also just give a brief mention to the ongoing development of the Mind of My Own
app, which is really, again, turning up some real positives.
You will see, Chair, from the report in 2 .2 that the corporate parenting strategy is now
complete.
Here it is, hot off the press, the sky's the limit.
That will be launched again on Friday.
This, as colleagues will know, has been a real collaborative work with our ambassadors,
the voice of Gloucestershire, those on the corporate parenting group, our colleagues
from health, education, housing, the list goes on, youth justice, police, and importantly
the third sector.
To borrow from Osed, and I hope I'm not preempting what they say, the sky's the limit, the name
of this document, immediately highlights an aspirational approach.
As you can see, the voice of children is explicit throughout.
To repeat the comments that I made in the recent Cabinet report when I presented this,
I'm sure all colleagues will recognise the work that the teams have done in preparing this strategy.
It is explained the successes we've had to date in what we have achieved within the report,
but equally as important, Chair, what more will we do? So critical.
There are six key priorities for those of you that have a chance to look at the document
from pages 13 to 22.
The summaries are our voice counts, staying connected, staying healthy and well, stable
homes built on love, staying safe and achieving our potential.
Those on the corporate parenting group will recognise all those critical, critical areas.
As set out in the conclusion of that strategy, we believe that it takes a village to raise a child.
By way of background, all those involved in making this happen are identified in the document
and the corporate parenting group will be leading on measures going forward to measure progress and to monitor impact.
Also, Chair, as you're probably aware, since the last report, we published our Home at
the Heart, which is our sufficiency strategy.
That's a terrible, terrible way to describe it.
Home at the Heart is so much better.
It pretty much does what it says on the tin, for those of you that are old enough to remember
the advert or the meme.
The focus is on homes rather than placements, and it is there to reinforce the family -first
approach so important, so important for our young people. It supports families to
care, enables kinship arrangements for our children and young people who can't
live with their parents and where that isn't possible, we've made kinship care
a focus as you know chair, we will always try and favour foster family
arrangements with a focus where safe and practical in enabling our young people
to grow up and move on within Gloucestershire. That's why in the budget
We'll discuss later on chair as you know
We will continue our investment in four of our own children's homes
I was really excited about that and the supported accommodation project for our care leavers a
Brief and very positive update on that area in particular. We have an advanced educator
Recruited to work across all homes. We have an administrator in place to support all homes
And the administrator will be taking an initial focus on King's home house
The building work is completed at King's. I'm really excited fully furnished
The majority of staff are recruited and being inducted as we speak or as I speak
Barnwood the building work is completed for the main house. The pod plans are being redrafted
Great news a registered manager is in place and as with King's home
The majority of the staff have been recruited and again are being inducted
Moving on again positive news Robbins would read well 80 % building work is now complete that probably further forward as of today
Southfield
The building and design work is going very well. We're continuing our meetings with residents
I know councillor drew takes a particular interest in that I met with the residents group again
last month
Moving on short breaks and respite. There is a report coming to cabinet next month as
As mentioned in my previous report chair, I'm really excited by the innovative work we're doing with the Barnwood Trust
I'd also like to thank the team at heartwood who allowed me attend allowed me to attend their
parent carers event on site and it gave me a real
Opportunity to hear from the staff and see the latest developments of the building. I'd encourage any colleague that wants to go and see
what they're doing that to go the
Fantastic team and as reported and mentioned previously at our ambitions board our kinship strategy has been
recognized nationally for the quality of its practice
big big chapeau to them as
Discussed at the scrutiny committee and at ambitions board we continue to see a reducing level of agency staff
Our vacancy rates are now the lowest for more than three years
Our turnover is at the lowest level since reporting began at directorate level
Our out -of -county placement levels continue to drop although I'd like to see them go further
They are lower than our statistical and indeed our national
Neighbors, it's also worth noting that a significant year on year reduction
in residential homes placements has taken place again building on the
families first, be at home at the heart of everything strategy.
If colleagues have any questions regarding the Ambassador's Report, which is section four of the document,
I'm happy to pass those on. I would just single out amongst the many highlights. The Graduating Care app is now fully live
and
so pleased to see them arranging the putt -putt social.
Really, they're a great bunch of young people doing so much for their cohort.
I will on a serious note again just ask us to recognize the work of the PAWS project
which is now operational that as you know benefits individual young mothers.
I think close to a hundred have been identified for support.
And one of the knock -on effects and that's probably the wrong way of describing it
because it is an important secondary effect is that it reduces the demand on social work services
services, particularly within the court arena.
So again, if colleagues would want more information about the PORS work, please do let me know
and we'll pass it on to our excellent officers.
Our ETE approach is set out, as you can see, in section five.
The employment and skills hub is working with the youth support services and the leave -in
care teams to establish a joined -up action plan.
I visited the commercial road based teams last month listening to them was again very stimulating
And gave me an awful lot of things to work on the key thing
Well, it came out of that part of nature
Was the challenge that we have in reaching those?
You know very rural and hard to reach areas where there may just be one or two individuals
that have challenges with transport
and indeed have challenges in where they can
potentially get work experience or volunteering
because they're not in the larger urban areas.
There's an issue that I've raised with the teams.
It's part of their action plan.
I also raised it more recently at the
health and wellbeing board partnership.
So it's very much under review,
but I do flag up that that is an issue of concern
I think for all of us.
And finally, Chair and conscious of the time, and we've got a big budget to talk through,
I'd like to put on thanks through you, Chair, if you're happy to do that, to all those involved
in the Virtual School Awards.
It's always such great fun and really stimulating and inspiring to see our young people achieve
so much.
And through you, Chair, if you think it appropriate, I'd like to pass on our thanks to the supporters
of that award, the Peter Lang Trust and the Sedbury Trust,
although I do declare an interest.
I was a previous chair of the Sedbury Trust,
but I'm not currently involved,
but they sponsor those awards.
Secondly, as you can see in the report,
the football match for our unaccompanied asylum -seeking
children and teens set out in 8 .1.
If appropriate, again, I would hope, Chair,
that you would want to record our thanks
to both Forest Green and Montpellier FC for their support. I have no doubt
anything any of us do that we will see a significant increase in unaccompanied
asylum seeking children when I look at the situation in the Middle East, in
Ukraine, in Central Africa and sadly in a number of other places. So the more we
can normalize your situation through things like football when they come to
I make their homes here. I think the better and finally finally
Councillor Evans, I mean in that last report we gave quite rightly
It might you championed the work of our our teams
and
Highlighted the fact that they need credit. So I'll just share one story. I was talking with Dan drones
Last week who told me of a social worker who had to deal with an emergency breakdown
a very difficult situation which was running on until very late at night.
Another colleague stayed off and remained to help that social worker to
ensure that that young person had a safe and secure place to go to and that is
not an exception that is very much the rule with our teams. I won't name the two
individuals then but you know I asked Dan and Dan you passed on our
Thanks and his thanks in particular to to those individuals
But again, I say that is the rule not the exception and we are very blessed with the teams
We have who go above and beyond to help our corporate children and young people on a daily basis. Thank you
Yes, thank you for that positive report and
Chair - 0:52:24
Any questions members? I've got councillor Evans Ben
Cllr Ben Evans - 0:52:35
I'm delighted to be able to direct the question to you.
We thought the cabinet were having the day off and the leader needs to give his voice
arrest so I'm delighted to be able to address the next two questions to you.
So the first one is a serious one, the second one is slightly more whimsical.
So the ETE outcomes working group, absolutely necessary, Councillor Cowie and Councillor
and Halifax as well as other colleagues on all sides,
have really pressed home about the importance of this.
The report that we've got today is noticeable
from any statistics, they're noticeable in their absence,
whereas normally you do have stats around that.
The question is whether, sorry,
when those baseline assessments of where we're at
will be able to be brought to council,
because I think that'd be really useful for us.
We have stats about a number of looked after children
who aren't in E2E, et cetera.
But because that in -depth piece of work's going on,
I think it'd be really useful to bring,
obviously, to scrutiny, but to this council.
And the second question is,
is there space in the football team for any members
whose brain says they can still play football
even if their body might be slightly blanket?
Councilor MacLane.
Chair - 0:53:47
Yeah, thanks, Chair, and thanks, Ben.
Cllr Paul McLain - 0:53:51
Sorry, Councilor Evans.
Yeah, you're absolutely right. I'm happy to make sure we get the stats out. From memory,
and don't absolutely quote me, I know that in terms of our care leavers, we actually
have, I think I mentioned this in the previous report, we actually do much better than our
statistical neighbours and nationally in terms of care leavers that are in employment training
in education, but it is not good enough.
It is still a very low process, low bar that we've achieved,
and then some, but it is not good enough.
So that's why I'm really keen to progress this.
Happy to take this, you know, I ask Anne and the team
to provide stats again.
We can go through scrutiny if the chair's happy with that.
Happy to bring it back to full council.
The second point on football, the last time I played football
on behalf of the local authority, I was accused
Are you bringing my rugby skills to the football?
pitch
But yeah, I if you or anyone else wants to get involved then that would be brilliant
Yeah, I think it just shows how much we want to do to help those young people. Thank you chair
Thank you for that next up councillor drew David
Chair - 0:55:05
Cllr David Drew - 0:55:08
It's five two on the youth support team
Do we manage to persuade the whole of that team to come over back into the local authority?
Well back into local authority so that they
Were crucial to what that provision?
entails
where are they actually co -located now with the
Care levers group where's where's the physical base?
It would be useful to know
Councilman McLean
Chair - 0:55:44
Cllr David Drew - 0:55:45
Thank you, thank you
Councillor drew
Cllr Paul McLain - 0:55:49
Yeah, I mean what I'll do if I may is take that offline. I'll ask Lynn speak to contact you
I'm not aware of
anyone that transferred over from
Prospect sure trust, you know not transferring over but
I again don't quote me Lin will be the perfect person to advise on that in terms of place
There is some co -location within commercial road now as I understand
But again, let me get you all the details rather than me just speculating. Thank you chair
Thank You councillor Cohen Linda
Chair - 0:56:27
And at the
Cllr Linda Cohen - 0:56:30
recent Gloucestershire Young Carers Conference which was organised and led by the young carers
themselves. We were told that there are 6 ,000 young carers in the county who are unaccounted
for. The young carers also told us that a third of them attend schools where the schools
don't know that they are young carers. I wonder whether we might consider, as part of our
corporate parenting remit, to extend it to the young people who are young carers, young
people and children quite often and that we should look out for those young
people who are actually doing the looking after. Thank you. Thank you.
Chair - 0:57:09
Thank you Councillor Maclai. Thank you Councillor Cohen. Thank you chair through
Cllr Paul McLain - 0:57:12
through you. Yeah I mean I like you I attended that conference it was it was
stimulating. It gave me a number of different points to raise in terms of
whether we ask all our young carer, consider all our young carers, corporate
parents. Let's take that offline, some I suspect would want that, a number as I
think we heard when we listened to those young people speak directly to us,
probably not. But let's take this offline and work on it. It is quite clear
we need to do more to support young carers but also as you and I heard and
indeed a number of others that attended that conference, there are a considerable
number of those young carers that do not want to be identified, that do not want to be involved.
And if they feel there is some sort of stigma in becoming corporate children, young people,
we don't want to force their hands, but happy to discuss this offline.
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you for that.
Councillor Hay, Colin.
Chair - 0:58:11
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr Lisa Spivey - 0:58:16
Just about within a few days, a year ago, at the budget meeting, a
Cllr Colin Hay - 0:58:23
budget amendment was passed with everybody's support,
which was about looking at the way in which we could help foster carers maybe take on more children by issuing grants, loans, whatever it was.
A year later, we don't have that scheme. It's there in the background. Why has it taken a year?
It was recognized at the time that this could save money, but not only that, we may be able
to keep families together instead of splitting children apart.
And for nothing to have happened really, the work's gone in the background, but in terms
of actually going out there saying who wants a loan, it hasn't happened.
Why the delay?
You know, and I just think that this is indicative of a bit of a malaise within the administration
that, well, exactly, you're yawning because you're a tired administration.
And it takes so long.
It takes so long to actually get things through, particularly, it's past its business case.
So it potentially can save money and is worth doing.
But it's oh so slow. It's time for a change
Hopefully that will be in a few weeks time
Chair - 0:59:50
Council McLean, oh dear
Cllr Paul McLain - 0:59:52
on
Yeah
forgive me chair I
I'm conscious that the elections are you know fast approaching us?
And that some opposition colleagues will want to score political points
But really on corporate parent is this far too important as you know from our previous conversations
Counselor hey and indeed your conversations with the officers. This is all in the train
I know I stood up and explained exactly what was happening to say that work is going on the background is something of an
understatement enormous work has been going on the business case has now been approved an
Individual cabinet member decision will be taken and you know full well as has been explained to you on several occasions both by myself
And I suspect by officers in more detail exactly the reasons why so it an individual cabinet member
Decision will be taken on the fostering adaptations and it will be going forward as soon as is practical. Thank you chair
I'm sorry you brought on such a distasteful tone there
Chair - 1:00:55
Okay
Councillor Spivak
No
Chair - 1:01:07
Apologies Lisa Chloe. Yeah. Yes. Sorry
Chair - 1:01:11
Cllr Chris McFarling - 1:01:14
Thank you very much good morning councillor McLean and
Firstly just want to acknowledge that clearly lots of good stuff happening and lots of things going in the right direction. I suppose and
Cllr Chloe Turner - 1:01:24
My attention though is drawn to the statistics that aren't going in the right direction in particular school absences and suspensions
Where I completely appreciate we are tracking a national trend
But we are worse both than the national figure and our peers and there's nothing about that in the report
And that really is what I want to understand is how what are we doing about the things that aren't going so well?
So I wondered if you could say a little bit about what work is happening there. Thank you
I
Cllr Paul McLain - 1:01:58
Thank you chair and thank you for the question you're absolutely right to highlight this
This is an issue that we should be concerned about
As you know, there is an explanation or a limited one. I accept that within the
appendix which references the suspensions
Talking with Jane Featherstone as you know as the head of the virtual school
She is at pains to point out that in 17 years. We have not had a permanent exclusion, but
Children in care and the vast majority of our children in care
You know are doing well at school that have good attendance in terms of exclusions. There is a challenge you will have seen
The offstead comments whether we like a more loath them and that's me
You regarding school attendance
It came out beginning of this week
So I think we do need to do more
I'm happy to take this offline Jane Featherstone has been working with Dan Jones and Paul Shaw cross on this because we do need to
address
Throughout the year you see the numbers build up
And we have as you know our personal education plans
Which are there to address this particular point as well as the other support that our young children
I'm happy to take this offline and discuss more with you if necessary through the scrutiny
committee.
I know the chair takes a particular interest in this.
It is an area.
It has been identified.
We do need to do more.
Thank you for that.
Chair - 1:03:33
Councillor Hoyland.
Becky.
Thank you, chair.
Cllr Beki Hoyland - 1:03:37
I'd just like to say that the reduction in the number of people who are in the room today
the number of children in care is obviously really welcome.
But I'd be really interested to know
how many of these children have been adopted
or have special guardianship orders.
And as a member of Adoption West's Grutiny Members
Committee, I'd like to highlight that although the children that
have been adopted are no longer children in care,
the vast majority of them are care experienced.
I know that the virtual school has provision
to ensure that they looked after in their education and that adoptive
families have access to universal services but I think we need to make
sure that they have specific support as well as they will need that support
going forward and I'm wondering if it could be more visible in our corporate
Chair - 1:04:35
parenting report thank you thank you for that Becky Paul I mean that's
Cllr Paul McLain - 1:04:37
that I'm
Thank you, Councillor, to you, Chair.
I mean, you're absolutely right.
I mean, a great point to make in terms of the breakdowns.
I'm sure we can get them.
One of the joys of the corporate parenting group is that allows us the flexibility,
particularly within the six subgroups, as colleagues will know, to really dig down
into this and forgive me, I think you made a particularly valid point about those
that are care experience that have left care.
We do need to ensure that the support is still there
I know you take a real genuine and enthusiastic interest in this happy to take this offline
I know you'll be talking with officers. Anyway, thank you, sir
Okay
Next I have Councillor Baker Paul
Chair - 1:05:22
Cllr Paul Baker - 1:05:24
Thank you, my main question has actually been covered but on the subject of football
I noticed the reference to forest greens. I thought I better chip in here and
and
Seriously Paul if you would like to liaison me about arranging a visit to a match at Chutney time for some of those asylum
Children, I'd be very very happy to coordinate that. Thank you
Chair - 1:05:48
Cllr Paul Baker - 1:05:50
Cllr Paul McLain - 1:05:51
Thanks for you chest, thank you for that is so kind
Genuinely genuinely appreciated. I know there'll be so many young people that want to take that up
The only caveat I would put in is we wouldn't want them to feel in any way
Stigmatized or you're identified but I know we won't do that. That's really kind of I will I will I will be in touch
Cllr Paul Baker - 1:06:12
Chair - 1:06:14
It would be very nice to come to a Football League club after all
Cllr Paul Baker - 1:06:17
Thank you members
Chair - 1:06:22
Moving on councillor Miller Andre
Cllr Andrew Miller - 1:06:25
Yeah, thank you chair. Thank you for that great report Paul. I thought it was good.
I thought there was a couple of good questions from our green colleagues across the spectrum
Chloe and Becky. I just want to pick up on a close point with regards to school exclusions.
Where you were that John Hubbard from Wilshire is also chair of Adoption West Scrutiny is
doing a national task force on children's mental health and in the LGA recently he's
published a case they mentioned,
focused on Gloucestershire,
noting the significant improvement, actually,
that this council has made in terms of school exclusions
since 2016, when they were absolutely way above
the national average and statistical comparators.
And will you take a good look at that task force,
task and finish group results once complete?
Thank you for that, Councillor McLean.
Chair - 1:07:26
Cllr Paul McLain - 1:07:28
I think the honest answer is yes, thank you for bringing that up.
You also made a really important point about mental health and wellbeing
and that I think is something I know you've championed within scrutiny as our colleagues are sitting on scrutiny.
That's something we do need to keep a very, very close eye on. It's so important and so many issues.
Thank you for that.
Councillor Robinson.
Steve.
Chair - 1:07:52
Thank you, chair.
Cllr Steve Robinson - 1:07:56
Back earlier on in the year, I asked the then cabinet member, Councillor Davis, regarding
targeted youth work in the Stroud area, and I had a reply from the officer to say that
family action was taken over in October of last year.
I was expecting them to have taken over the service
for targeted youth in April as they did
with the children's centres.
But now they took over in October.
I am concerned that youth workers in the Stroud area
are still not being contacted by family action.
Could this question please be asked by the cabinet
member why they're not going out to youth workers
who are dealing with a lot of targeted young people
in the Stroud area, please?
Thank you.
Mr. Jones.
Thank you for that, Steve.
Councillor McLean.
Councillor McLean.
Yes, thank you, Steve.
Chair - 1:08:58
Cllr Paul McLain - 1:08:58
Absolutely.
I know you take a particular interest in this
and you've got your track record of doing good work.
Thank you for flagging that up.
We'll take that up and keep you informed
Thank you, I don't have any other members questions
Chair - 1:09:14
No, thank you for that
Councillor Maclay and
so moving on
petitions

7 Petitions

Item seven. I have first of all two petitions from councillor Chloe Turner a safe crossing for children at the
fourways crossroads Charles third
Charles Ford a
pedestrian crossing also for sorry ancestor Road on the residential section through Mitch in Hampton
So if you'd like to present those Chloe, please
Cllr Chris McFarling - 1:09:48
Thank you very much chair. Yes two petitions two very similar public subject matter actually in both cases
Very unfortunately a young girl was hit by a car
Two different places in my division, but the incidents took place within a week of each other
In both cases they are at a site where the community has for many years been calling for a pedestrian crossing
So particularly upsetting and that these incidents have happened and on the back of previous incidents as well
The first petition a pedestrian crossing for siren says the road on the residential section through Minchin Hampton
received a total of
296
signatories 89 of them handwritten and and the second in relation to the
crossing at the four ways crossroads in chalford received 260 signatures and I
did ask a related question put a question to this meeting in relation to
the mention Hampton petition I have been seeking some support for additional road
safety measures in relation to the new medical center which has just exacerbated the existing
problems in Minchin Hampton. I got a very sardonic I would say and also factually inaccurate
answer which I'm not happy with. It's suggesting that the road safety measures were a matter
for the District Council when quite clearly they're a matter under section 278 of the
Act 1984 the County Council as the transport authority so I will be picking
that up separately with officers but these are two really serious incidents
and the community is really calling out for help and I very much hope that we'll
be able to support and so thank you very much and I will now present to the cabinet member.
Chair - 1:11:47
Yes thank you Chloe. To Councillor Davis the leader please.
Thank you for that.
Chair - 1:11:57
I also have another petition from Councillor Cohen, Linda, on the right to use the right
to use their nearest tip.
I do apologize, it's poor handwriting there.
But I'm not sure where it is.
So I'll hand over to you, Councillor Cohen.
Cllr Linda Cohen - 1:12:15
So this is about the people who live on the end of the A38 who suffer from the thing that
I keep coming to this council about, which is the fact that because we live at the end
of the county.
Many of the services that would be the most logical ones
to use are actually in South Gloucester, not in Gloucestershire.
So the people that live in places like Stone and Newport
have to drive to the Horsley tip, which is 30 miles away,
rather than using the one in Thornby, which is six miles away.
This makes no sense at all, petrol, the environment.
I don't need to explain the reasons why.
It just needs somebody to have a conversation.
I've asked for this to happen.
There's an answer in my questions about it,
which doesn't seem wholly satisfactory.
But if people would just start communicating,
then we could do things intelligently
because the only people who miss out are my residents
who suffer from the fact they live on the edge of the border.
So this is one piece of paper, just the right to use,
the right tip, it's not complicated.
Thank you, Linda.
Chair - 1:13:14
To the, to Councillor Gray, David Gray.
Chair - 1:13:37
I've been made aware Councillor wide born. Do you have a petition as well Roger? Yes,
I do chair
Cllr Roger Whyborn - 1:13:42
Thank you. I have a petition on behalf of 1400 names in Cheltenham a
petition raised by Max Wilkinson MP and supported by cancer Julian Cook who is here today and
The concern is about the household recycling center in Swindon Road and the closure of it or it's now closed
and the request is for the two councils to work together and for
the county council obviously to
take up its role as the
waste
Not collector the other one waste
Waste disposal authority and
To involve itself here as a waste disposal authority
In that situation, which is of great concern to residents bring that forward now for cancer gray
Chair - 1:14:41
Thank You that cancer were born and for
Councillor David gray to receive please
Cllr Roger Whyborn - 1:14:47
Thank you, members.
Chair - 1:15:11
No other petitions?
No?

8 POLICY AND BUDGET FRAMEWORK - MEDIUM TERM FINANCIAL STRATEGY

Okay, thank you, members.
So moving on to item eight, which is the main budget.
Can I invite Pete Bungard, the Chief Executive, to explain how the budget debate will take
place?
Pete?
Chief Executive - 1:15:36
I think you have a most wonderful flow chart in front of you.
But if I can summarise it, there's just three things happening here.
The first is the Chair will propose suspending a procedural rule, and that will mean every
single budget proposal, those of the administration,
those of any opposition group, are on the table
all at the same time, and you do not take a vote
at that stage.
So that's essentially stage one.
Stage two is an adjournment, which if we get it right,
will align with the lunch break, where group leaders
and whoever they want to bring in the room
can decide how that discussion goes.
and the third stage
essentially for
amendments there's three ways they can go they could be supported in full or
slightly amended as a friendly amendment to the administration's budget
they could be withdrawn by the proposing opposition group or
Other opposition group could insist that they are taken to a vote
Just to remind you any vote relating to the budget must be a recorded vote
So that's it three stages first stage starts now, which will start with the chairman
allowing us to have all the proposals on the table and the suggested order is
the administration present their budget and then
opposition groups in turn put their proposals on the table
Thank you, chief executive.
Chair - 1:17:19
So can I ask the council to indicate support for this approach?
Happy members?
Yeah.
Okay.
Thank you.
Chair - 1:17:36
So I propose that under procedure rule 23 .1 to suspend procedure rule 12 .5.
This allows more than one amendment to be moved at one time.
I look for a seconder, please.
Deputy Chief Executive - 1:17:51
Thank you for that, Councillor Williams.
Chair - 1:17:54
Seconded.
So with that, I will move to the cabinet member for finance and property to propose.
Pardon?
Sorry.
Jumping ahead.
So can I put that to the vote, please, members?
We're suspending their procedure to do the yes.
Chair - 1:18:21
Thank you members.
So with that can I ask the cabinet member for finance to propose the budget and proceed.
Councillor Stow Linden.
Seat 21 * - 1:18:35
Thank you very much chair.
Cllr Lynden Stowe - 1:18:37
First, can I thank all of our officers who have been involved in the formulation of the
budget which I'm going to present today over several months, and in particular I want to
thank Nina for the initiatives she introduced this year.
Secondly, I'd like to thank members across the Chamber for your input during the scrutiny
process, and to acknowledge the consultation responses from members of the public, our
stakeholders and staff.
And to thank you for taking the time to do those and to refer
members to those responses within our papers today.
Also within our papers are the equality impact assessments.
And again, I particularly draw members' attention to those and
trust that you will have weighed up the factors represented
within those reports within your decision -making process today.
But let us start by recognising one thing.
The budget in front of you today is one which will be the envy of many of our peers.
This is a solvent council.
One of the acid tests of a solvent council is the management of our general fund reserves.
Four years ago they stood at 18 million pounds, today they stand at 33 million pounds.
Our general reserves are up by over 80 % in a period when the reserves of other authorities have plummeted.
Our proposed revenue budget for 25 -26 increases the current year spend of £616 million to
£655 million, an increase of £39 million or 6 .3%, although with our conservative and
use of reserves that increase rises to an average of 8 .6 percent at service level.
First an increased budget for adult social care of 9 percent nearly 18
million pounds more as we protect our older people and those who need our
support the most. Secondly an increased budget for children in care and
services of 7 .3%, over £13 million. This budget has increased by over 60 % in the last
five years and that's absolutely the right thing to do, to invest in our young people
and invest in future generations.
All of our directorate departments will have increased budgets next year, as laid out on
page 65 of today's report.
None of our directorates are having cuts to their budgets.
And I also say that in the knowledge that our current financial performance year to date shows each of those service departments predicting either a balanced spend or an underspend.
That is without precedent during my time on this council, I believe.
And it is important to record that those figures are helped once again by the extra surplus from income streams for electricity generated at Jaffelin Park.
This administration takes very seriously the setting of council tax.
When we have to pay our account, we have to ask our council tax payers to pay a little more each year.
In fact, we take council tax out of the pockets of people who work very hard and don't necessarily have a lot of disposable income.
So it is though with a heavy heart that I do ask you to support today's council tax request for a 2 .99 % next year, together with a further 2 % for adult social care levy.
In total, that will represent an extra £1 .53 a week for a Band D council taxpayer.
Whilst the government settlement for our budget this year is OK, OK, it is not as transparent
or as generous as those received in the past three years.
However, I do worry, I do worry about what's going to happen next.
Today we have a report that inflation is back on the rise again, up to 3%.
And with respect to that, you ain't seen nothing yet come April, May, June, when the new payroll tax comes in.
We have an economy that is at best flatlining.
And yet we have the demographic challenges of an ageing population and no growth to pay for it.
We are seeing increasing numbers of people needing send packages, but funding isn't being raised at the same rate.
There has been no government reset of DSG.
Nationally, growth and aspiration are being wiped out for a generation.
Gloucestershire and its peoples and its economy are under attack.
Many of our older people have been robbed of the money they used to pay their winter fuel bills.
Our farmers, our small businesses and rural communities are under a multi -directional attack.
Even our pubs are under attack.
and taxpayers' money of Gloucestershire is being diverted to the metropolitan areas.
There is still an unknown impact of the new payroll tax.
And you will all remember Chancellor Reeves saying in her first, hopefully her last, budget
that the public sector will be fully reimbursed.
I didn't believe her then and I don't believe her now because our best calculations are
that £800 ,000 of direct payroll expenditure has not been funded and up to £4 million
in our supply chain, predominantly care workers, has also not been funded.
Across Gloucestershire, this new Labour Payroll Tax will take nearly £250 million out of
our economy.
And who knows where that money will end up?
Probably in some desert island in the middle of the Indian Ocean.
Then there is the new education tax.
Unparalleled, unparalleled in the Western world,
parents of children across the spectrum of abilities
are being left high and dry.
And it will be several years before the full impact
of this dogmatic policy is felt on school places,
budgets and the Council's home -to -school transport budgets.
Revenue spend is though by its nature year -on -year. What is equally important is investing for
tomorrow in building a brighter, greener future for our future generations. So let us turn
to our capital programme, which is on page 76. This capital spend includes £217 million
of new spend. So adding that into our extant position, we now have a capital pipeline of
£590 million. That's a lot of money and that's all being invested into the future of Gloucestershire.
It includes £320 million for transport and highways to continue the M5 Junction 10 work,
continue bus routes, cycle routes, more drainage schemes, road safety measures and more.
It includes £88 million for children and families, new special school and more resources for send pupils, school expansions and upgrades.
It includes £67 million for adults, which includes £57 million to build three brand
new care homes.
And a £23 million investment in our first class fire and rescue service.
Finally, I want to highlight the allocation of capital funding for a new heating system
here at Shire Hall.
a completely decarbonised system.
And that is just one example of the work across the council
that our staff carry out, that our members carry out,
our cabinet members carry out, our procurement officers
and our planning officers, our development teams,
Chair - 1:28:54
working to do whatever we can to help mitigate against climate change.
Cllr Lynden Stowe - 1:28:58
Climate change is embedded in our budget in front of you today and I have now have much
pleasure in proposing that budget.
Thank you, Chairman.
Chair - 1:29:08
Thank you, Councillor.
Thank you, Councillor Stowe.
And seconder leader of the Council, Councillor Davies.
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 1:29:21
And I also want to start with thanks.
I just want to thank Lyndon for the hard work he does on this.
He gets into all of the detail, understands it,
and I think today articulated it particularly well.
I'd also extend my thanks to Nina,
not only for the work she did in doing this a different way,
which made this a much more inclusive exercise,
but as a new leader, her personal support to me
in making those decisions.
So Nina, thank you very much for that.
And I'd echo the thanks to scrutiny for the work they did.
Though I sort of felt on the day there was a distraction,
as everybody wants to talk about devolution.
One of the things I did want to stress in this budget
is we are not going to be distracted from doing the day
job during all of the work we will also do on LGR
and devolution because that is how you go bankrupt.
Ask a liberal Democrat, run Somerset.
So we are solvent.
I have said this a number of times.
When I became leader only in September,
I didn't think this was a big deal.
But oh my god, I have a list of almost all of our neighbors.
I have to say of all political persuasions and the amount of cuts they have had to make
in their budgets, a large number of them liberal Democrat, it must be said.
So why are we solving them?
I asked the question the other day actually why are we solving them and it's not an accident.
It's because of decisions we've taken like the energy from waste, difficult decisions
that didn't always get full support.
Improvements, the endless and relentless improvement in our services and the transformation work
that Stefan is leading and we've seen that in the report Linda has just given you in
those budgets that have come in on track, including children's, which suddenly has come
in below and on track on its budget for the first time since I stopped running it.
But also we haven't made any stupid decisions.
We've not made stupid investments.
We have done sensible things to support the people of Gloucester.
So it's not an accident.
It is the result of what we have done.
And those who are not in this fortunate position do have themselves to blame.
And go look at the peer review.
Many of you won't have had time to see it yet.
It is absolutely glowing in its support of the work we are doing in continuing to transform
the services to Gloucestershire.
We had it from Colin earlier, a tired administration.
There's nothing tired about what we're doing.
This is a proud day for Gloucestershire in a budget that shows growth.
And I just pinpointed the line that Lyndon said, growth in every department's budget.
That is the clear indication we have not made cuts to make this budget.
Go find me another council to do that.
So I always tell the story that news, if a dog bites a man that's not news, but if a man bites a dog that's news.
Well, actually having a balanced budget shouldn't be news, but it is.
It is the headline currently in this area.
And I wanted to pick a couple of areas where we've seen real in progress.
A specific 10 million in highways.
It will be interesting to see if the Liberal Democrats vote for that later, as they're
always criticizing us for that.
2 .1 million in SEND.
I knock on doors like many of you do.
And one of those issues that comes up regularly is special educational needs.
Now, this won't fix that.
that fixes a wider national problem, but it is aimed at getting educational psychologists
to look at those waiting lists and help reduce them where we can.
$12 .8 million for special schools, the third that we're going to build, again, to address
that problem of special needs.
$7 .5 million, three new care homes designed to deal with the new challenges of adult social
care, where actually our objective is to get people back in their homes, out of hospitals,
But there may be a transition stage one of those in Stonehouse
12 .4 million for improving schools that almost is a nobody noticed it in the budget, but I want to point it out to you
It's a big investment and rather cheaply 1 .3 million for household waste centers
Because if you don't invest in them you end up closing them ask shelter
So we're now going to have a debate on what else we can spend money on and this is unique
Let's be absolutely clear your colleagues in other councils have been arguing about which cuts to take
They have not been arguing about which amendments they make to spend more so feel privileged and recognize that privilege. I
Have to say I'm disappointed I have had sight of some of the amendments are going to come and
We did indicate to opposition parties the flexibility we had in budget
the Liberal Democrat amendments already nearly twice what we told them we could afford.
Do you know why Liberal Democrat councils go bust? Because they can't do the maths.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So I strongly recommend this budget and I encourage you to have an active discussion about what extra things you want to do
rather than what things you end up having to cut. Thank you.
Thank you for that, leader.
Chair - 1:34:23
And so further proposals.
I'm going to go to Liberal Democrat leader, Councillor Lisa Spivey.
Thank you.
Cllr Lisa Spivey - 1:34:35
Is that right?
Can you read?
Anyway, thank you.
Well, my goodness, even by the usual standards, that's an uninspiring and tired administration.
I would also like to start with some thank yous. I'd like to thank officers and our section 151 and deputy chief executive in particular for the way in which this year's budget has been put together.
Nina, this is your first budget at GCC and I know from speaking to the senior leadership team that whilst this hasn't always been a comfortable process,
that the words breath of fresh air, chalk and cheese, and night and day amongst
others exemplify the difference and the approach which you have successfully
embedded. So from the Liberal Democrats also thank you. Thank you for stepping
into this role with such commitment and challenging the status quo. This is
exactly what this council needs much more of and I hope that in the future
you will bring more of that change to bear upon this organisation. With that in
I'd like to turn to this year's budget and the Liberal Democrat amendments to it.
To status quo versus challenge and change, to reactive versus proactive, to
managed decline versus ambitious vision, to Conservative versus Liberal Democrat.
Fellow Councillors, I stand before you today responding to this final
conservative budget in this current long four -year term after 20 relentlessly
disappointing years of conservative control at this authority. I rise to
challenge the stagnating effects of accepting the status quo and offer a
narrative of change, to challenge a culture and leadership where we are
always on the back foot, always reactive and never proactive, to challenge the
situation of managed decline we find so many of our services in and offer an ambitious
vision for Gloucestershire for crumbling roads, years of backlogs for children needing EHCPs
and reports which put our key services in the requires improvement category are no longer
acceptable. I stand here today to offer you a different approach, an offer of real change,
of ambition for our county and its residents. A Liberal Democrat approach.
For budget setting, deciding how we spend the money in the public purse is a
political choice and the choice here today is clear. It's either stay as it is
with potholed roads, falling down signs, rising numbers of people killed and
seriously injured on our highways and homes at risk of flooding due to our
antiquated infrastructure not being able to cope with climate change.
It's people stuck in their cars because they don't feel safe walking and cycling.
It's generations of children stuck in the same old cycles of deprivation.
And it's people stuck in genuinely life -threatening debt -ridden despair.
Or it's something tangibly different.
It's energy, drive and determination to deliver real meaningful change.
It's moving from the back foot to the front foot, getting ahead of the difficult times.
It's delivering what our residents, the people we are here to represent, are asking for.
The Liberal Democrat Budget Amendments which we put forward today give a glimpse of that new approach.
They demonstrate our commitment to tackling the difficult issues we face, not once it's
too late, not once the tarmac has been washed out the pothole for the umpteenth time, not
once the children arrive at our doorsteps requiring help, not once the homes have been
flooded, but taking proactive steps before the problems arise.
We put six amendments today to the budget in order to begin that process of change.
four financed from the unallocated funding from the final settlement and
two which require using a small amount of our reserves. Now that point is already
made about the by the leader and a member for finance about using reserves
and and you know when you say that our reserves have gone up yes they have gone
up and that's great but also the number of children in care has gone up the
number of KSI's has gone up the number of potholes has gone up and the number
homes flooded has gone up. But I'm not going to be taking any lectures today
from Conservatives on finance. I won't be taking any lectures from a party that's
in national government committed to spending six seven hundred million
pounds on not sending anyone to Rwanda that spent ten billion pounds on wasted
PPE which was then to add insult to injury burned. And here in Gloucestershire
I won't be taking financial lessons from Conservatives who spent a million pounds on a lovely new council chamber
Which is now not big enough to sit a unitary authority in
Who spent more than 56 million pounds on getting children's services back on track after years of it failing
And who in the just in the last few weeks have renewed our highways maintenance contract worth tens of millions of pounds
with a contractor who has systematically failed to deliver good quality work.
Let's not forget about the party that was funding or should I say underfunding
local government for 14 years up to last July. The Conservative
Party which has set county councils across the country up to fail. With local
government funding cut by almost a third in real terms since 2010 it is no
surprised that by 2023 we began to see the disastrous impacts that a perfect
storm of increasing demand and decreasing funding had on our sector
with more councils issuing section 114 notices in that one year than had in the
30 previous years. Furthermore a recent LGA Commission survey found that a
quarter of 74 local authorities would be insolvent within a year of the statutory
override on the dedicated schools grant ending and another court just said they
would be insolvent within three years. With Gloucestershire's deficit set to hit
100 million pounds by the end of the next financial year I'm pleased to see
that this administration has finally woken up to the grim reality and has
taken the steps this year to begin to address the existential crisis this
poses. Other local authorities began this work years ago and don't face this
frightening prospect as was recently pointed out by our auditors. Our
proposals look at some key areas where we would like to begin the journey of
change. Modal shift out of cars, changing lives by targeting support to young
people in areas of high deprivation, road safety, mitigating climate change and a
transformative approach to public health. It is what our residents expect of us.
They tell us time and time again that they want proactive governance which tackles issues at its roots.
They want responsive services and active resilient and sustainable communities.
They want vulnerable individuals and households to be supported.
They want all the potholes to be filled in at once, not a few at a time.
They have told us in Gloucestershire that they want change.
They have told us that loudly and clearly in recent local and national elections.
They have told us that they are no longer willing to be taken for granted and that the
status quo is not good enough and that they want a different approach.
It's why Liberal Democrats now lead four of our six district borough and city councils
and that we now have three of the six MPs serving our county.
This proactive, hard -working, common -sense approach has resonated deeply with
residents of Gloucestershire and I am glad that they will have the opportunity
to send that message once again at the election on the 1st of May this year
despite this administration's attempts to deny them that chance. So colleagues, I
hope that today you will have caught a glimpse of what the future can hold for
Gloucestershire, an insight into the Liberal Democrat vision and drive to
deliver for our residents. With these budget amendments we propose a charter
of change and the first steps towards a brighter, better, more hopeful future for
Gloucestershire. I commend these amendments to you and ask you to support
them and show your commitment to change and to the people of this county. Thank you.
Thank you for that, Lisa.
Do you have a seconder?
Chair - 1:43:52
Councillor Hayne, Colin?
Thank you.
Cllr Colin Hay - 1:43:58
I'll join in with the thanks to Nina and what's happened in the last few years.
And it is, that's the shame of it.
Suddenly, the party opposite have woken up, smelt the coffee and thought,
my goodness, we've ruined the coffee.
really got to do something about this.
So there's been some change.
20 years of not doing enough.
They're making investments, and they're
going to have to borrow money.
Borrowing money at 4 % instead of recognizing
what needed to be done years ago when interest rates were
less than 1%, practically.
And the PWB, we could have made the loans then.
making those investments that would have saved money,
and they ignored it because they're fixated
on not having debt.
Most companies, anyone that runs a company,
and I'm sure somebody over there has run a company,
will know that you got to borrow money
to make investments to grow that company.
We would have done that.
We had a situation where Children's Services
had one bad Ofsted, what happened in that intervening time, a cabinet member failing around and not able to fight his way out of that paper bag, and we had another really bad Ofsted, and it's taken years, and on average has been quoted before on about 100 million to get out of special measure.
So we're in this situation because of them not doing their job properly, not investing,
of leaving things to be broken before they're fixed.
That's the attitude of knowing and lauding how much they're spending and not knowing
What they're getting for it not having a vision of what the future might look like
That's why
Internal audit said about highways contract. They couldn't give a value for money
Sort of option that you know that they could actually give assurance on value for money
just recently as Lisa's just said there's been the
most recent
Audit from our new auditors KPMG. They said on send they put it in as a risk
unlike other some other councils
Because councils in the southwest were about two years ahead of us in mitigating that send deficit
We should take that seriously and it doesn't appear to be so
our budget amendments just touch the surface really and
And if the tour is over there, say, oh, it's reckless spending, let's have a look.
So in terms of our capital, it is .25 % in banking terms, 25 basis points of the budget.
Or to make it simpler, it's 25p out of the 100 pounds you've got in your pocket.
In terms of the revenue spending, it's even less of a percentage.
It's .14 or 14 basis points.
14 pence when you got 100 pounds in your pocket.
That's what it's about.
That's what our amendments amount to.
And then we put them there because it shows a direction of travel.
That modal shift that's talked about.
It's it's actually understanding what is happening in terms of our roads a
Lot can be saved. We've heard about these abandoned
Road signs as if they don't matter they do matter
They make the place look as tired as the administration over there
The signs which really stand out on the roads are how much this council spent
And a few yards down the road, the real road signs, which tell you which direction to go
in and so on, they're covered in algae.
They're overgrown.
But oh no, we will lord what we've spent.
We don't know what we're getting for it.
And actually, we're not even keeping our contractors to the task in hand because we don't have
the contract management we should have.
So much money is wasted how much money is spent on potholes that are washed out the next time it rains
That's got to stop all of our amendments can be saved by being
Chair - 1:49:05
Stricter if you can someone please Colin. Thank you very much for the
Cllr Colin Hay - 1:49:07
extra a few points of a second. Thank you
Chair - 1:49:20
Thank you councillor Hay I now move to the Labour leader for your proposal amendments
councillor blocks and John Thank you well this Gloucestershire County
Cllr John Bloxsom - 1:49:29
Council we're talking about our budget amendments so I'm not going to talk about the Chagos
Islands or Rwanda our budget amendments are designed to suggest the council we make some
improvements so we put in an amendment around highways local enhancing that to
make help make our roads safer something around community transport provision in
order to help get community transport options off the ground something around
flood alleviation to further help to make our County more resilient and some
Continued funding for youth work provision in order as a dedicated fund for small grants for youth work
And the last one that's listed there is called community investment fund
This is a word to describe what we have had under the current council
Which has been the build back better counselor fund or in the previous council was called the growing your own
community fund so these have been invaluable
sources of assistance that members can provide to people in their wards.
Many of these are bona fide community projects that have come forward requesting assistance.
That's certainly been the case within my division.
They've not been used as a way of giving bungs to mates or political associates.
They've been genuine local causes that have been seeking assistance.
So for example, and many other members will know this in my area, that's resulted in grants being given to
Robber Playgroup, Cassius Green Playgroup, the Community Hub,
a very successful community hub that operates in Cassius Green from the Community Centre,
Community Gardening Projects in Cassius Green, Kingscourt and Ebley,
Youth Clubs in Cassius Green and Robber,
Canes Cross Rugby Football Club and Cassius Green Youth Football Club, environmental projects
such as Walbridge and Robborough CIC, defibrillators in primary schools such as Gastroles and Foxmore
and at the Kingshead pub, a pump track which is currently under construction at the Victory
Park managed by Canes Cross Parish Council and the Access Bike project which is based
in Lodgemoor and does work with young people to promote cycling and make transport more
acceptable amongst providing other forms of assistance.
So we've suggested putting in what would be equivalent to what we've had in the current
council, which is 10 grand in next year to continue with that fund.
And obviously we would hope that there would be further discussions about the ways in which
this could be continued in future years.
Obviously after May there will be a new council in some form or other and there will also
be a new budget process for that council to steer through and obviously nationally we're
going to have the spending review and changes to grant regimes as has been outlined.
So we think these, continuing that fund will help to make a small contribution to those
various activities within our communities.
It will help to pump prime some of them to get them up off the ground and it will help some of them to attract
Other funding so they can say we've got off the ground. We've got a grant
Here's our plan and there it helps to unlock other funding on a matched basis. So
We think that this is something all members across the council ought to support. We hope that all members find it of value
We are disappointed not to see any provision for it within the base budget.
So we brought this forward as an amendment for year one to keep something in place and
obviously we look forward to the response that we have yet to receive.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, John.
Chair - 1:53:37
Do you have a seconder to your amendment?
Councillor Thomas -Wendy.
Thanks.
Thanks very much.
Cllr Wendy Thomas - 1:53:42
I will just briefly second what John has said.
I think the amendments that we propose are practical. I think they're reasonable and I think they
Would make a difference to our residents lives and John did a good job of describing several of them
But I would just like to chime in in particular to our proposed amendment of an additional
50 ,000 pounds for natural flood management and we all have heard of some schemes that have gone on around
Gloucester County Council where natural flood management has actually made a huge difference to local residents
And just recently in a village in my district division Yuli population
1100 they have a flood warden
They have a dedicated parish council group who are committed to trying to address some of the flooding issues in Yuli
They are in a deep valley
There is so much rain and runoff that their drains are full water is running down the sides of the valley and they've had
a good initial meeting with a flood warden from Stroud,
and natural flood management is the type of thing
that would help support the ongoing issues
that they're having.
And just being able to provide extra funding
for things like this would make a difference
to these villages that are trying to deal
with things like flooding at a time of climate change.
I think another area where we could really make
a small difference, but a measurable one,
Is in some a small pot of money to support business cases for community transport
I think there are still villages around Gloucestershire that have no transport whatsoever
I'm thinking of Arlingham, which would love to have the Robin come through its village
But currently it does not and I think being able to build a business case for these parts of the county that are completely underserved
by community transport, a transport of any other kind, would enable them to make the
case more robustly for how they need some connection to the rest of the counties, where
residents are able to get to work, to school, to hospitals.
So John did a great job talking through the other amendments. I will chime in on, I think,
every counselor in this room has enjoyed having that Build Back Better Fund, to be able to
make a real difference to your villages, your towns, your parishes, and it would just be
inconceivable not to have that fund continue into the next year.
So I would strongly commend that we support these reasonable and practical amendments.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, Wendy.
I'll then move to the Green Party.
Chair - 1:56:19
Do you have any proposals, amendments?
Councilor Cody
Thank You chair
Cllr Cate Cody - 1:56:24
I'm delighted to put forward our proposed budget amendments for this year
As previously we started to think about these as a group really early and were pleased to speak to the leader of the administration
And to officers to get things into a position where they can realistically happen and I thank all involved especially Nina
We successfully managed budget amendments last year,
including 300 ,000 for natural flood management.
And recently we visited sites to see three exciting
new schemes which are progressing well and will
benefit residents by reducing the risk of flooding,
be more aesthetically pleasing whilst enhancing
nature and biodiversity too.
We are therefore really happy to be putting in more
funding for further natural flood management.
This time as waterscapes projects by Gloucestershire Wildlife Trust who have a successful track record in this area and are ready to carry out further work in a beneficially professional and very cost effective manner.
We're well known for our love and support of our county libraries having helped fund them previously.
And we have two proposals this year, I'm going to put those together, again to support the
eight community libraries, essentially with funds to help with upgrading and maintenance
of the buildings, and a second initiative to set up another one or two library of things,
building on the success of the pilot model in Charlton Kings.
We're keen to support the great work of Green of Gloucestershire and their Climate Action
fund which was heavily oversubscribed last year.
The projects are led by community groups, parish
councils, and CICs, and must additionally
show that they positively influence behavior change,
which is something highly aligned to green ethos.
Another of our amendments last year
was around enabling veterans who were seeking work
to benefit from free bus travel.
And this has proved so popular that we're
to be topping up the scheme and help it to continue this year.
And ultimately we're aware of the great work of volunteer master composters and engaging
a part -time coordinator to manage them and promote community initiatives will be hugely
beneficial to the county.
Finally in addition to public transport our group recognises that the car is still a popular
mode of transport, particularly necessary in some rural areas and we're keen to support
a study based on successful car share models happening elsewhere, car club models.
Our amendments are about delivering green projects for the benefit of Gloucestershire
residents whilst additionally reducing carbon, protecting nature and supporting reuse and
community sharing and values. Therefore we very much hope that they will be accepted.
Thank you, Chair.
Thank you for that Kate. Do you have a seconder for your proposals?
Chair - 1:59:30
Councillor Turner
Cllr Chloe Turner - 1:59:36
I think Kate has said it all really but I just wanted to emphasize that these are relatively modest
Asks modest expenditure perhaps we used in the Green Party to making a little go a long way
But they're very much embedded in tried and tested initiatives either here in the county already or looking to peer councils
and other areas of things that are already working really well on the ground.
They have been carefully developed and validated with officers to make sure that they will
deliver and on a timely basis and to meet real needs.
And they will really deliver value at the local level for genuinely sustainable communities.
So we'd very much like to recommend them to you today.
Thank you.
Thank you
Chair - 2:00:21
Independent councillors to have any amendments from independent councillors
No, thank you. Chair. I think the budgets
Budget is absolutely fantastic
Thank Steve Davis for the excellent proposal
Linden and the rest of the team. I think it's absolutely phenomenal budget and I couldn't have done any better
Cllr Alastair Chambers - 2:00:45
I passed several accountants and they all said the same thing.
It's absolutely fantastic.
Chair - 2:00:50
They actually mentioned that, it's a bit disappointing, that the...
Sorry, Ked, you chose to stop debate at the moment.
So if you have no amendments...
I'll get onto the failings of the liberal Democrats in a minute.
Yeah, yeah.
When we move on to the debate...
Thank you very much.
Yes, appreciate that.
Thank you, Alistair.
So with that, we have all the amendments out.
I'm going to propose an adjournment now.
Chair - 2:01:17
Lunch is available so I think we'll take lunch break now.
So 45 minutes we'll start back up again at quarter to one.

8 POLICY AND BUDGET FRAMEWORK - MEDIUM TERM FINANCIAL STRATEGY

C
Take our seats, please.
Chair - 2:02:01
I'm gonna hand over to the Chief Executive, Pete.
Thank you.
Chief Executive - 2:02:09
So, final session in this.
A discussion happened between all of the groups over lunch.
The leader of the council will tell you
which amendments have been accepted as friendly amendments.
then the other group leaders will tell you of the remaining
amendments they put forward, those that they wish to carry on
for debate and vote and any they have removed, et cetera.
So it's Stephen first.
Thank you.
So after what was, I think, a good discussion,
We have agreed that we will accept all of the amendments by the Green Party.
And let me just say a sentence on that.
One of the reasons I'm keen to do that is that we worked on these, as Kate said when
she introduced them, since I think the first meeting was in November.
We have had officers look at them and make sure and ensure that they are deliverable,
which is really important to me.
Small pockets of money that have no impact are not a good use of our finances.
So these we believe will have an impact
and therefore very happy to accept all of those.
We have then also tried to put together
what will actually be a conservative amendment,
but I'd like to feel comes from all of us,
two amendments to address issues raised
in both the labor and the lived -in amendments.
The first is flooding.
Flooding comes up consistently.
So we're going to put 500K towards flooding
and we are at this stage of short notice
not gonna work out the split on this,
but the split will be between gully clearing,
because that I think was quite correctly identified
as an area to invest money,
mainly because we did gully clear all the gullies
at the beginning of the winter,
but some have obviously got killed again by the bad weather.
Second one is flood alleviation,
which is the wider, more strategic problem
that we need to spend money on.
And the third one is to back up what we're doing
with the Green Amendment on the Gloucestershire Wildlife Trust
in what they're doing,
partly because every penny we spend there,
we get a level of extra funding as well.
If we can find other projects that they can usefully
use the money, we will include that.
So that's a 500K to try and be an umbrella amendment
to cover off items in both the Labor
and the Lib Dem amendments.
And the second one is 430K for youth services.
Again, items raised in both of those lists of amendments.
And where we want to target that is primarily
at our youth services as delivered
by our children's services and build something around extra youth workers targeted at disadvantaged
areas and looking at how we might roll that into expanding our family hub capability where
that's appropriate.
Again, the details will be worked out and will come to cabinet as a decision.
But we also earmarked some of that money.
A number was not put on it that we might look to allow communities to bid for additional
funding.
Again, there will be a cross -party process in which we agree who gets the funding, and
Cllr Stephen Davies - 2:05:15
we will set some criteria that will clearly acknowledge some level of disadvantaged children
and young people that we're trying to address, rather than the blanket 3K for every counselor,
which we felt was less effective in that area.
So that's sort of where we're at, and obviously you can guess from that that we rejected all
of the other amendments, but I will leave the other party leaders to talk to those.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, Leader.
Chair - 2:05:48
So now I go to the Liberal Leader, Lisa Spivey, for the unsupported budget amendments.
Cllr Lisa Spivey - 2:05:57
Thank you, Chair, and thank you, Leader, for recognizing the importance of the amendments
that you have accepted, really, really important that we begin this work of
change and I think in those two areas which have been accepted then there are
areas where we will begin to see that and really you know targeting especially
for our children and young people you know we are never going to make change
unless we invest in that targeted approach so thank you for that.
However, I do want to keep on the table and I will be brief talking to the other amendments
that we had proposed because again, I think they are really, really important.
And I mentioned it in my speech and, you know, Lyndon brought it up about by our reserves
being up.
But, you know, it is also noted that, you know, our number of children in care in those
last years have gone up.
They are coming down now finally, but they have gone up.
They went up.
The number of killed and seriously injured on our roads
continues to go up.
We're not making any impact on really reducing that.
The number of potholes, I think, in answer to one of the questions.
We've got 80 ,000 or something?
I mean, goodness, that is definitely going up.
And so I think we can say that these things are making changes.
And then Chloe, thank you today for bringing those petitions.
I think that just summed up exactly our amendment around funding for extra pedestrian crossings.
I mean this is what our communities, and you said it Chloe, they're crying out for it.
They really desperately want these things and that's not just about genuine safety because
in those instances that you've mentioned there have been accidents, but in places where people
are not wanting to walk or they're not wanting to cycle because they don't feel safe. And we simply
don't have any kind of funds where we can bring that about.
I know speaking, you've heard me talk a lot about it
in terms of the rural communities in particular,
one which I represent in South Cerny.
I've got a question in today about crossing
on the Spine Road.
It's a very, very busy road in the Cotswolds Lakes.
I can't get a crossing there.
The community has been trying for eight years.
We just don't hit the numbers.
We're not.
When we're looking at things from a quantitative basis
in rural communities, I call it rural discrimination,
It just never happens.
There aren't enough people killed or seriously injured, and that's a terrible thing to have
to say.
So that's why here the Liberal Democrats are putting forward, still want to have these
amendments because they're really, really important.
We will not get people out of their cars to walk and cycle if we don't make improvements
to local cycling infrastructure.
We spent 26 million quid on one cycle spine, which is brilliant, but what about all the
other things that we desperately want. You know those small bits of money that
we know as local councillors within our own communities will make a difference.
We all know how we could spend ten grand here, ten grand there and really really
make a difference. So I'm really imploring you to think and look at your
consciences today and think about whether you really want things to change
or whether you're happy with the status quo, whether you're happy that people
don't feel safe to cycle, whether you're happy that people in your
communities won't get the pedestrian crossings that they are all desperately
crying out for. Whether you are happy that you know that our countryside that
our local highways and our verges are in an appalling state with signs left
behind algae as Colin said growing on on the signs and really not being dealt
with with pot tools that get filled in and two weeks later they're washed out
and all of the tarmac the coast black tarmac is left on the roads. Are you
happy that you know within our director of public health has said to me on a
number of occasions the two things that she would do in the priority she would
do in public health to change lives is to increase debt advice services. We know
that there is a terrible number of people who really tragically take their
own lives and within our County and that that kind of thing is largely a lot of
it is driven by debt, by falling into that financial hardship, and we could really start
to change people's lives if we start to make these improvements. So I'd really implore
you, look at your conscience, look towards your communities and think how much this money
might make a difference to those most in need today. And please, I commend you to support
these amendments. They are going to take a small bit of money from our reserves, but
they are really incredibly important. It's status quo or change, you decide. Thank you.
Chair - 2:10:47
Thank you Lisa. Do you have a seconder? Colin?
Chair - 2:10:57
Yeah, okay Thank You cancer hey, I now call the labor leader
Chair - 2:11:12
councillor blocks them to propose any amendments
Do you
Cllr Lisa Spivey - 2:11:24
I'm if we're amend this would be our amendment. So don't doesn't that amendment get discussed or
Is the suspension of standing order is carried through on this?
I just wonder how the two debates are going to go alongside each other. So
Yes, okay, we'll go to that separately so if we could hold back from
Chair - 2:11:52
the labor amendments council block serve
Say that so
We haven't stated here
if you want the Lib Dem amendments debated separately, the chair is
saying that's fine. Yes I think the clarification there is that what we
Chief Executive - 2:12:13
understood was that we would have our amendments debated separately but
not voted on as individual so en bloc in terms of I'm proposing four amendments
still but they would have their own debate as opposed to having both the
And the chair says he can accommodate that. Thank you so much
Thank you, okay, so with that I'm gonna go to debate on the liberal
Chair - 2:12:39
amendments councilor Hodgkin said
Thank you, yeah, I have absolute pleasure in
Cllr Paul Hodgkinson - 2:12:48
Supporting these amendments and I wanted particularly to talk about the clean and green
an extra fine and fix gangs amendment,
which I think is really, really good
and just disappointing that the Conservatives
are not supporting this.
I thought it was very interesting earlier
that the leader of the council talked about this
being a proud day, feeling privileged
about the transformation that his party has made.
Well, you know, just look at the transformation
that's happened over 20 years
of Conservative rule in Gloucestershire.
Look at the state of our county.
And the state of our country is bad enough, but our county.
Look at the block gullies.
Look at the potholes.
Look at the drains that are never emptied.
Look at the roadworks where signage is strewn around for months or years.
Look at the state of the verges.
Look at the unreadable signs, the trees and bushes in the road that are never moved.
All of these things are a huge and marked deterioration over 20 years.
Everywhere you look, it's worse.
And I think this is a very sad and unacceptable image of what we have become what Gloucestershire has become
the marked and visible
Deterioration that makes us feel that our county is not as good as it was
It absolutely isn't and when you travel around when I travel around the rest of this country. I
Rarely see an area which is as bad in terms of civic pride and the state of our infrastructure
And when I travel in the rest of Europe, it is on a different level.
We have really, really gone behind.
And it's only when you travel abroad you actually notice these things.
So I'm staggered that the leader is so complacent and arrogant that he believes this is a positive
transformation.
And I will leave you with, because some of you know, obviously, I – a bit of a plug
– I do a radio show that some people have appeared on.
But you know, I'm reminded of that great track from the 80s by Chris Rea, Road to Hell.
I'm also reminded of that great track from the 90s, Road to Nowhere by Talking Heads.
But most importantly I'm reminded of a classic track when I was at secondary school in the 70s by The Stranglers,
Something Better Change, because absolutely on May the 1st something will change. Thank you.
Thank you for that.
I used to like the Stranglers.
Chair - 2:15:12
Right okay.
Thank you for that Paul.
I've got Councillor Wyborn.
Thank you chair.
Cllr Ben Evans - 2:15:29
The Cabinet Member for Finance mentioned that the reserves had gone up to 33 million from
18 million and it sounds to me like a modest dip into those reserves would be a very appropriate
thing to do to invest in the infrastructure as per the Liberal Democrat amendments and
to do the things, or to start to do the things that this county desperately needs.
I mean, I'm glad to see the investment in gullies and flooding.
I'd have to say that...
Oh, I got the wrong one.
Cllr Roger Whyborn - 2:16:07
Okay, we think that's...
Can everybody hear me now?
Okay, right.
And on the cycling, I mean, what the cycling lobby is telling me, not just the lobby but
casual cyclists as well, is what they really want is not the £26 million spine, that's
wonderful, all looks great, but what they actually want to do is to be able to do relatively
short journeys on the shortest possible route and to have alleviations at junctions and
contraflow streets and a number of fairly simple
and cheap measures which would really transform
their situation.
So not doing the 100 million per district on cycling
is a really short -cycle move.
We need to get more people onto bikes and out of cars.
And it's the same as the safety thing
that people are afraid to cycle because of,
and it's the same with the pedestrian crossings
where you know people are crying out for it. We've got demands from all over
certainly Cheltenham and I'm sure it's the same and Lisa's already said so in
in other districts and with the way our current system of safety priorities
works it is pretty well impossible to get a pedestrian crossing in your area
unless unless it's financed by somebody else like section 106 or some other
source of funding.
And it's really, really necessary.
And it's another thing that will help to get people
walking because they feel able and safe to do so.
And of course, on the roads, I mean, yeah,
the Find and Fix program is great, but there's not
enough of it.
And, you know, to say that we can't afford to spend
another 450K on that, I mean, it's false economy
because all these potlots are going to have to be
and met are going to have to be repaired eventually and I I've done down
Whittington Road this morning and and you know it was like a farm track looks
like I'm out of time now so I was going to go on and say a lot about buses but
that's been hard over the last 20 years and it needs a new administration from
May the 1st to really get some life into this thank you Thank You Roger
Chair - 2:18:31
Next on my list, Councillor Baker.
Paul.
Thank you.
I primarily wanted to talk about crossings.
Cllr Paul Baker - 2:18:41
And I think it's a shame really that the Administration couldn't accept all of the amendments by all
three groups because all of them had an awful lot of positivity and reason to support.
And given the equal amount of this budget, the amount that was being proposed in the
every one of those amendments would have made a difference to people.
I particularly want to talk about crossings because crossings, frankly,
it's like putting teeth in this authority to get a crossing.
It really is one of the hardest things to get achieved.
In Cheltenham, I think we as ables get two crossings.
The first crossings we've had in Cheltenham for years.
And yet, crossings are a no -brainer.
They increase mobility for people.
People trying to cross roads who are disabled or elderly have got no chance
unless they've got a crossing to use.
Young people, children going to school, have got no chance,
their parents will only let them cross roads
unless there is a pedestrian crossing.
It slows traffic down, it encourages people to walk.
It really is a no -brainer, it's win -win -win,
and yet we can never get them done.
Because when I ask for one, there's no money.
You can put some of your local highways money,
but if I put 10k to it, it's nowhere near funding the cost of a crossing.
And when I speak to officers, well, there's no funding for crossings.
It's in the overall pot.
It gets lost.
Crossings are so important.
They resonate with every one of you in your communities.
We heard from Chloe earlier on, and I couldn't say any better than she did, expressing the
desire for crossings in our communities.
So let's support that amendment.
And let's even put more in.
Let's have some priority to pedestrian crossings, because rest assured, the new administration
Certainly will thank you
Thank you for that Paul next up councillor Harris Joe
Chair - 2:20:35
Cllr Paul Baker - 2:20:37
Thank You chair today we debate a budget that is nothing short of an indictment of 20 years of
Cllr Joe Harris - 2:20:46
Conservative failure a budget that fails the people of Gloucestershire a budget that forces residents to pay more
For fewer services a budget that cements this administration's reputation as reactive
rather than proactive. Let's talk about the reality facing my residents in
Sire ancestor after 20 years of the Conservatives running this council. Our
youth club closed down. The Conservatives have slashed vital support leaving young
people without safe spaces or indeed opportunities. Bus services devastated.
Communities are cut off forcing more people into cars, worsening congestion
and air quality. Council tax up 75 % since 2005 on a Band D home. Yet services just seem
to get worse. Roads worse than ever. A 17 % highways budget cut since 2005 has left our
streets riddled with potholes. Residents' compensation claims are ignored while this
administration shirks responsibility. Yet despite these failures, the Conservatives
somehow find a million pounds to upgrade this lavish council chamber and four million pounds
for consultants in just one year.
The Conservatives are obsessed with council tax rises and what do we have to show for
it?
The Lib Dems today put forward a series of sensible budget amendments that would make
a real difference.
But let's be honest, we didn't expect them to support our amendments.
time and time again, this administration has refused to listen, whether that is to us or
indeed to residents.
Nothing highlights this indifference and arrogance more than a Conservative councillor from Cheltenham
popping up in Tethbury knowing he can't win in Cheltenham, assuming it's a safe seat.
Residents there deserve better than to be taken for granted, and I know that residents
will vote with their feet in May.
This Conservative -run council has had 20 years to fix these issues.
Instead, they've let services wither, they've let infrastructure collapse,
and residents are footing the bill, literally through higher council terms.
Gloucestershire deserves better.
We need a proactive administration that invests in the future,
not one that papers over the cracks of its own failure.
We need a strong leader and Councillor Lisa Spivey is that person who will lead
and inspire our County. We need a Liberal Democrat led council. It's time for
change here in Gloucestershire. This budget doesn't do that and I urge
everybody to vote against it. Thank you.
Thank you for that Joe.
Next I have Councillor Chambers.
Alistair.
Chair - 2:23:37
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr Alastair Chambers - 2:23:41
I've got the budget, the Liberal Dema budget somewhere.
Where is it?
Sorry, just looking for it.
Oh, here it is, sorry.
Just by the toilet roll.
So, yeah, so here it is.
300 ,000 youth schemes.
But thankfully the Conservatives already planned that back in December last year.
So, absolutely fantastic.
You want the 500 ,000 for bike improvements.
Conservative Council give around a circular 40 million all the way from Bishops Cleve, I think,
down to Stroud or Gloucester.
Huge, one of the biggest cycle paths in the country, I believe so.
Fantastic there
pothole gang you want three pothole gangs a
Couple of issues here you'd be going about that. There's such issues with potholes
They wash out every two seconds and they're there but you want three more of the same gang that doing already
What's going on there?
Like you really got to do what you're doing not only that you've budgeted four hundred fifty thousand for the three pothole gang
so I take it you don't often speak to highways because a pothole gang costs two point five thousand a week and
and three -pot -all gangs would be seven and a half thousand a week.
And just say for example they worked every week, never having a break, never having a holiday every week, 52 weeks a year.
That would be 390 ,000 a year. You've got 450.
Is that 60 ,000 spare for, if you are administration, for your overspend on PR like you have in the Cotswolds potentially?
Maybe even that as a sort of reserve.
Extra funding for a £100 ,000 debt advice.
The best advice I've got to give you here, and you can have it for free,
is stay with the conservative budget,
don't have the Lib Dem,
otherwise the county council itself
will need better debit advice.
So that said, let's just reflect on county council.
The reserves, acid tests already been done,
80 % increase financial stability.
And let's look at some Lib Dem organizations
that are locally Cotswolds.
250 ,000 overspend just on PR,
just on saying how great they are.
250 ,000, quarter of a million overspend on,
oh we're really great. And then there's also Joe Harris here who was just saying
about the instability of the Conservative budget. It was himself only a
few months ago in the press saying that his Lib Dem run association council is
facing bankruptcy. So I stick with the Conservative, I stick with the
Conservative ethos, I stick with the Conservative budget. It's proven, you've been
proven failure, you've proven it, you've even gone out to the press. So thanks for
I will stick with the reserve budget,
I will stick with the 80 % increase in
stability,
I will stick with the Conservatives who time
and time again have proven
stability when there is crumbling
associations like Windsor
Borough.
The point is, you have proven
you are a failure
at Cotswolds.
I really beg you, please,
adult services children deserve better,
so let's stick with Conservatives, thank
you.
Thank you for that Councillor Chambers.
Chair - 2:26:47
Can I call now the leader of the council, Councillor Stephen Devis.
I'm allowed to talk on the amendment.
I did check.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 2:26:57
Chair - 2:27:00
And then Lyndon will speak immediately.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 2:27:04
So yeah, because I'm allowed to talk to your amendment.
Chair - 2:27:07
Cllr Stephen Davies - 2:27:08
I did actually double check because I was confused, as I'm sure many of us are.
So let's just start by remembering what we have agreed, because I'd like to encourage
consensus where we can.
We did agree on two of the liberal democratic amendments, and we are making progress on
that.
So I think that's important.
And if somebody else says potholes, I might just scream, because you didn't actually put
an amendment in on potholes.
You forgot to do that, which seems incredibly odd.
Seeing that seeing as you talk about them an awful lot now actually your civic pride gang
It's about cleaning not polls
But anyway, let's go on to each of the individual areas actually the one that I think we do
We'll take on notice not as an amendment that I've been the money made the difference is
crossings and we are looking at how we approach road safety and Chancellor Norman is
Launching some work on that
Your amendment wouldn't make a huge difference financially to that but it's an area and one that I do accept on the others highways
I am wonder if you people ever torture highways manager
I had coffee with mine once a month and I raised the issues in the environment in my
Division and he does his best fix particularly those niggling ones like edges and signs that are damaged and so on
But we also in case you don't know who your highways manager is or you're talking to a member of the public
Fix My Street has transformed not only how we work, but how we communicate with people
the work we're going to do.
No acknowledgement of that, no recognition of that, but it has made a huge change along
with the rest of the transformation program which is speeding that up.
In other areas, you talk about the debt.
I have to say that is an insignificant number in comparison to what we already do with Citizens'
Advice Bureau and the Household Support Fund, which fortunately the government extended,
which allows us to help people in debt.
So I didn't think that was a significant number,
which is why we rejected that.
So we weren't rejecting this out of ideology.
We were mainly rejecting them out of practicality.
But let's just talk a few moments
as you keep mentioning things about how terrible we are.
You've based your budget on debt.
Well, I'm very happy to stand up and say
I reject that as a way to solve the problem,
particularly as we end up having to take
our own debt advice as we went forward.
I reject this idea we're not making progress.
You've seen the peer review.
You may not have read it yet, but please do so.
You will see, I can't predict what the OSTED report's
going to say on care leavers, but read that.
It will tell you good and interesting stuff.
Progress in the fire service.
Across the board, this council continues to improve,
which is what people expect from it.
And what's the alternative?
I'm not sure the Lib Dems have a policy on this,
but there are some of them wanting one unitary,
some two, that's expensive, some three.
That's really expensive. What a waste of money if you want to talk about spending money stop talking about duplicating the council twice over
Thank you
Thank You leader next up councillor William David
Chair - 2:30:10
Cllr David Willingham - 2:30:15
Thank you chair well we get stumped I'm stumped I hope your poptologist is proud
I
Just want to talk about debt advice
I represent the area of Cheltenham that's got the most deprivation according to the
latest statistics in the indices of multiple deprivation which came out in 2019.
But if we look at areas of Gloucestershire, Gloucester rather, including those around
and Matteson and Coney Hill, we find that the levels of deprivation and the indices
of deprivation there are actually even more deprived statistically.
And yet we have someone not willing, just on the grounds of politics, to invest in something
not that we say will help people who are in poverty, but something that has been said
by our Director of Public Health that will help.
It's such a shame that people are willing to play politics rather than helping their
communities
I'm funding something
Which the director of public health will say would make a real difference to those in most need
So I hope people will reconsider
And I hope some people will look at what their
Councillors decided to do especially those in some of the most deprived parts of Gloucestershire. Thank you chair
Thank you for that. Next on the list I have Councillor Hawthorne. Mark.
Chair - 2:32:01
Thank you very much Mr Chairman. I didn't want to miss the opportunity
Cllr Mark Hawthorne - 2:32:06
to speak of what
would probably be my last opportunity to comment on a Lib Dem budget. Now many of you know
that I first got elected all the way back in 1998 and I have to say in that 25 -26 year
period, I've been struggling to understand the point
of a liberal Democrat.
I have to tell you now that I still do not understand
the point of a liberal Democrat.
And if we look at the amendments that have been put forward
today, in Collins' own words, .25 % of the overall GCC budget.
And yet they've been planning for 20 years
for what they hope will happen in May.
They've been waiting for 20 years to come up with ideas about how they could transform and change this county.
And yet, all they could come up with today is .25 % of an amendment to our overall council budget.
Now in her speech, in her speech we heard from the leader of the Liberal Democrats.
By the way, that's about the sixth or seventh leader of the Liberal Democrats I've faced in this chamber.
and there was a bit of me thought that there maybe was a leadership contest already kicking off on the other side over there
but maybe that's just me being a bit cynical.
But what we heard from the leader of the Liberal Democrats was a lot of talk about SEND and potholes.
And when they unveiled their amendments, to our surprise!
There was no money for SEND and no money for potholes.
So once again, what we're seeing from the opposition is them paying politics with this county.
I am not going to take lectures on the amount of money that needs to be invested in areas of high social deprivation,
when in the last four years we have put huge amounts of money through local councillors like yourself, Councillor Willingham,
into local communities to support them rebuild and support their in -debt advice and rebuilding their local areas.
This is a council that is consistently invested, but we know what the future could look like
because we can now see very clearly for ourselves, live down run councils in Gloucestershire.
And we know what their priority is when they get into power.
It is not the priority of supporting local residents.
It's the priority of putting up their leaders' allowance on Tewkesbury by 51%.
It's the priority of spending a quarter of a million pounds on spin doctors that make themselves look good in the local press.
That is the reality of Live Dems in Power.
And we will do everything we can to make sure we will continue to have a conservative run council that delivers for the people of Gloucestershire.
Thank you Mark.
Chair - 2:35:02
Now moving on to Councillor McLean. Paul.
Cllr Paul McLain - 2:35:10
Thank you chair, thank you. I will just speak on the debt issue. I think
Councillor Chambers has very eloquently drawn attention to the desperate state of Cotswolds.
I think we could look at the Cheltenham model by their own advocacy which you've heard
during your debate which is borrow more money, raid reserves and we see where that's got
In Cheltenham, we've seen the sell -off of the municipal offices. We've seen just today
The desperate plea from Cheltenham councillors to save the recycling center that they've turned to bankrupt and they've turned to
Bail them out. So if anyone needs that advice, I would suggest it would be lived and run councils now the leader
reference the household support fund
So I will briefly touch on that in the amount of money that is already going in and just in the period from the 1st
of October
2024 to the 31st of March 2025
eight hundred and eleven thousand pounds is going to the six district councils for them to apportion between themselves
You know localized schemes with that discretion to target the needs of the most vulnerable
That's to provide support for food energy water bills household items other essential items
250 ,000 pounds going to the 7y energy agency for energy related support including provision for warm and well
Been a huge success over the last couple of years
250 ,000 to age concern
Sorry, I beg your pardon age UK Gloucestershire for the provision of food energy and advice for plate related support
You know directly related to winter hardship over the current period
13 ,000 to family action for community -based support
73 ,000 to aspire foundation for community -based support
779 ,000 for funding the supply of and distribution of food vouchers fuel vouchers white goods
household emergency support again
This is just over a quarter period and a million pounds just over a million pounds 1 million and 8
83 ,000 pounds to be allocated to provide food vouchers to those eligible for free school meals. That is where
Critical support is going from this council from a conservative led council and it is going
To our locality based districts in some instances for them to spend on debt relief if they need it. Thank you chair
Thank you, Councillor McLean.
Next have Councillor Gray.
David Gray.
Chair - 2:37:52
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr David Gray - 2:37:57
A lot of talk about finances and debt and borrowing, et cetera.
And the .25%.
I will take issue slightly with the response from Councillor Hawthorne about that .25 %
because I just remembered that classic bit of financial advice, which is what Mr. McOrber
said.
Annual income, 20 pounds, annual expenditure, 19 and 6, result happiness.
Annual income, 20 pounds, annual expenditure, 20 pounds, ought and six, result misery.
And fortunately, in this administration, we have a council, result happiness.
We have a financially sound council and the idea that you can just throw up a whole bunch of money and it has no consequences
It all has consequences
It's not coming from nowhere that money comes out of our residents pocket and as we've heard on many of the points that are being
Raised in that you've you've sung the praises of the cycle spine
We're still committed to delivering that cycle spine and it's not 26 million. It's quite a lot more than 26 million
it's 26 miles, the M may have confused you, 26 mile cycle spine that we're
delivering. So I think you can't just throw away other people's money, you need
to spend every little bit of money otherwise like Mr. McCorby you avoid
happiness and you end in misery and just accepting adjustments that have no basis,
no real substance I think will lead to misery. It may not happen overnight but
It's a slope that you go on because it's an attitude about being careless with residents money. So I'm happy that we reject these
suggestions
Thank you for that David next I have councillor Miller Andrew
Chair - 2:39:45
Cllr Andrew Miller - 2:39:51
Thank you chair I think for me this budget is about sound finances over a number of years
Which is allowed us to get to the brilliant budget that we have today
I'd like to congratulate Lyndon for his work over the last four years for prudence and marks over the last 14 years as leader and
To get to the position. We have another sound budget by our new leader Stephen
That's a result of decisions that have been taken over many years
For example wisdom in building the incinerator at Javelin Park
Which only the Conservatives voted to continue building only the Conservatives is a significant part of our income
It's a significant part of the reason that we are sound as an authority.
Another reason is careful attention to detailed costs,
while mindful of our responsibilities to tackle climate change.
And by the way, we are a Conservative -led council,
we are not a Conservative -controlled council,
I'd like to remind everybody.
As the leader of the Lib Dem seems to have forgotten
a number of other things that she's forgotten actually.
What about our successes?
We've had successes in tackling the vulnerable children's budget.
Why?
Through investment in early years and therefore reducing the number of children in care.
That's another mistake by the Lib Dems, by the way, the number of children in care is
coming down.
And as for their assertion that it would cost £100 million to get out of special measures,
we on this side do not recognise that figure.
It is a Lib Dem imagination, a Lib Dem error, because the Lib Dems are wrong.
What about the ridiculous assertion that this council chamber couldn't accommodate increased
numbers with some modifications?
Well, of course it could.
The council chamber upgrade, which delivered accessibility for disabled people, by the
under our obligations, was money well spent.
They should not attack us on that, given that we are increasing access to the disabled.
I'll try and be brief.
In reference to the Lib Dem amendments, they exceed the money that is available.
We have to have a sound budget.
We can't be like Somerset, which is struggling, having to make huge cuts to frontline services.
We are not that authority.
We are a sound authority, and it is only Conservative -run councils that can produce that sound finances
through years on years on years of careful management.
So the Luddam School for the Change on 1st May, well, the country voted for change last
June and half the country at least that voted for it regret that now I say be careful what you vote for
My message is simple vote against the lived
Amendment vote for the conservative budget and vote conservative on the first of May
Chair - 2:43:01
Thank You councillor Miller, I don't have any other members so at councillor the town such
Cllr Sajid Patel - 2:43:11
Thank you very much, Mr Chairman. This is a fantastic budget and we should be pleased
and proud of this budget. Let's not play party politics here, let's look and reflect on the
achievements of this council. That aside, we have to remember that there are so many
councils, especially Lib Demeron councils locally on our doorsteps that are in huge
debts are having to borrow millions and millions of pounds. We're not in that position. And
that's all sound to sound financial management by this administration, this conservative
administration and with the hard work of Lyndon and other colleagues and all the officers
in this council. And you talk about Lib Dems talk about potholes and potholes and potholes.
That's all they ever talk about. Do they ever report the potholes or do they just come into
the chamber and moan and whine about it? Because what I'm seeing is investments in our roads.
Since 2008, I've had partially or fully resurfaced 30 roads in my ward, just in my ward, 30 wards.
And that's because we're proactive on this side of the chamber.
We report stuff, if we see road signage that is unclean, report it.
Don't just drive past it and moan about it at council meetings.
Get on your feet and do something.
Okay, so I've just had Western Road resurfaced not so long ago.
And the good news is, at the end of March, I'm getting another road resurface in my ward, Alfred Street.
Absolutely brilliant news.
And you won't find any potholes in my area because I'm proactive.
I get out, I get out, spot them, report it, make sure they get filled up.
So, thank you very much for the investment in the highways.
Really appreciate that and lots more to come.
So that's really good news for the people of Gloucestershire.
It really is.
You talk about change, change is already happening.
Change is constant and that's what you're getting with the Conservative administration.
As a city councillor, we've now got a new Lib Dem administration run by a colleague over here,
Councillor Hilton. Yes, yes, a Lib Dem minority administration.
Nine months they've been in power, nine months and they can't even put together a corporate plan.
So if that's anything to go by, we're going to be in deep, deep trouble if this council is run by
the Lib Dems, honestly.
Homelessness is up in the city
since the Lib Dems have been in.
And we've also got the leader who seems to think
that it's his own personal empire,
the way he treats the opposition.
That's absolutely outrageous.
And I dread to think that we'd be in this position,
in this chamber, where you have opposition
who become leaders and treat us like schmuck,
treat us like idiots and think they can do
what they like to us and try and silence us.
Let's just hope that doesn't happen in this chamber. So please vote for the Conservatives that they're the ones
We are the ones who get things done. We're not just talkers. We're doers. Thank you very much
Next I have councillor house done Nick
Chair - 2:46:09
Can't be many councillors that get all before they start so that's got
Cllr Nick Housden - 2:46:15
to be a good thing
Mr Chairman, thank you.
We've had some quite sort of weird and wonderful speeches today and I'm going to talk to the
budget and the area specific for the area that I represent.
Interestingly though, one observation I would make before I get to the Stonehouse specific
elements, one interesting thing to come out of the talks today is it turns out the Lib Dems
and I do have one thing in common, which is we could both do a quarter of a million quid
for a spin doctor.
Let me start on, before I get into the Stonehouse stuff,
I'd also like to make a point about,
there's been a number of comments about football clubs
and things today.
And I was delighted that Great Albury Youth Football Club,
which is a new community in my area,
had the opening of their football pitches
a couple of weeks ago.
To see a new community sort of congregating
and playing sport there was a real delight.
So I was delighted to attend that.
And that's a football club doing great work in my area along with Stonehouse town football club who are supported for a number of years
So the budget specifically
I'm really delighted mr. Chairman that there's nineteen and a half million pounds in this budget for a new care home in Stonehouse
I think that's absolutely fantastic
And something that my area has really really been crying out for this level of investment for some time
That's a total of a part of the 57 million across three care homes in this budget
Which I'm absolutely delighted to see
And I also welcome the 16 and a half million pounds in the budget for the new sense school in Abbeydale
A topic that is particularly thought close to my heart as SC and D and what that means for the county
So to see that level of investment in new school, which is I think we all agree really needed is really important
Along with the additional two million to try and get the SC and D waiting list down
Which I think we're all in agreement is a it's a massive issue
The further money for roads an additional 10 million on top of the hundred million already
Pledged is a really important to see and I know across my ward since I've been there
We've had over two hundred thousand pounds spent on the roads and there's still lots to do, you know
We're honest about that but to see more money again for roads is something that that I really welcome
I probably end by just making this point that if there was a
a council tax rise was separate to the budget.
I would be voting against that element today.
I think council tax rises at this time
for many of my residents is simply unbearable.
Got residents that are really, really struggling.
But when you put it in the context of the overall budget
and what it means to my area,
this budget is absolutely something that I can support.
This budget for my town means more jobs locally,
it means care home locally for residents,
it means more money and more placements
for young people of SCND and it means more investment in young people across the board.
So this budget is absolutely something that I'll be supporting today.
So yeah, that's it.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, Nick.
Chair - 2:49:15
I don't have any other members wishing to speak.
Councillor Tepper, Brian.
Thank you, Chair.
Just a few words.
I
Cllr Brian Tipper - 2:49:26
Talked while looking at the budget today. I think about
places like Somerset and Bristol
We're reading in the headlines today that both of them are selling the family silver to break even
Closheshire did that in 2009 when they took over the
administration from the Alliance and
We had to sell the family silver
simply because we had to put the mess right.
The reason we did, the outcome of doing that
is exactly where we are today.
We've put together a positive way of moving forward
and staying in a situation that we can provide the service
that we've intended to do and continue to do.
continue to do.
Typical alliance, they grab the headlines,
provide the service, find out in two years
or three years time that they can't afford it,
and they stop the service.
And basically, that's the way they do things.
They scrub the headlines today, make a big issue out of it,
and frankly, their way of life is unsustainable.
sustainable and I suggest that we
the voters
remember that
today with the character of the budget and with regard to the the way they vote in
They for this year with regard to the County Council elections. Just remember who
Continues to provide the service that we we've adopted and we intend to keep
Providing. Thank you
Thank you for that Brian I
Chair - 2:51:23
Don't have any more members. So I will come back finally to
councillor hey who's second in the Lib Dem amendment
Thank You mr. Chairman and I just want to
Cllr Colin Hay - 2:51:35
Agree with Brian tippers last speech there that
You know in 2009, it was a mess and the County Council had to sell the family silver
That's after four years of Tory administration because it changed in 2005.
So I think it supports our argument that leaving it and being entrusted to the Conservatives
does create a mess.
They're all very pleased at the progress they've made in the last year.
And it's like somebody who's had a car and they keep on being told, you've got to get
it serviced, you've got to get it serviced,
and it's belching out smoke, and you've got to get it serviced.
And then it gets serviced, and it's starting to work properly.
And they say, whoopee, look what we've done.
It works.
Yeah, you should have been servicing it
all the way through.
That's the problem.
Underinvestment when you should have been making it.
You watched children's services go into decline.
You feel, on the press statement it says on adult social services, yeah, actually
the recent review was really good because we knew where we were. Requires
improvement. Now that's great, isn't it? It's not. It needs changing. Yes, I agree.
The amount that we're putting in here is insignificant, but it shows what we're
to do that kind of modal shift.
So 99 .75 % is the same.
We're talking about .25 % that makes it too far.
I know Matt's 8 .5 % is fine.
Yeah, it's fine.
25 basis points.
Anyway, they...
It's not borrowing either.
And the other thing is...
We're not borrowing.
None of this is about borrowing.
What we're saying is it can be taken from reserves and the point is
The earlier today we were told that all departments are either showing a balanced
Or an underspend
They're on track for that
We can't commit that underspend until the financial year end
The likelihood is as was talked about today
Was that there will be under spends and those under spends can go straight back into those reserves
So they're back to where they should be
But what are we asking for?
We're asking for these shifts, which is so important
Actually making cycling feel safer
So that people do it more the pedestrian crossings. It's making a start on all those things
This is what we need. We need a change it is tired
this administration, it has mismanaged, and we need to put it right.
And we can do that by being much more careful about the money we spend.
Colin, can you sum up now, please?
Chair - 2:54:44
Oh, I can sum up as well.
No, if you'd stop now, please.
Cllr Colin Hay - 2:54:48
Chair - 2:54:49
I did maths A -level, but I just could not work that out.
Yeah, OK.
Right, where are we now?
Right, we're going to go to the vote, I think.
Yes?
Yeah.
Yeah, there's no other members wishing to speak.
So we're going to vote on the liberal Democrat amendment.
So whether you're for the liberal Democrat amendment or you're against the liberal
Democrat amendment, Councillors, they will call out your name and you have to vote yes,
no or abstain.
So I'll hand over to Stephen.
You're doing it?
Yeah.
Okay.
Democratic Services - 2:55:33
As Vernon's explained I'll read out your name for against or abstain on the Lib Dem amendments
Carol Alloway Martin against Matt Babbage
Paul Baker for
John Bloxham for
David Brown for Alistair Chambers
Kate Cody abstain
Linda Cohen. Stephen Davies. Against. David Drew. Ben Evans. Stefan Feiffeld. Bernie Fisher.
Andrew Gravels. David Gray.
Against. Terry Hale. Tim Harmon.
Joe Harris. Mark Hawthorne. Against.
Colin Hay. Alex Hegenbach. Jeremy Hilton.
for Stephen Hurst.
against Paul Hodgkinson.
for Nick Houseton.
against Becky Hoyland.
Mark McKenzie Charrington.
against Chris McFarland.
Paul McLean.
against Andrew Miller.
against Graham Morgan for Don Morris against Jill Mosley for Emma Nelson
Dave Norman such Patel Allen priest Phil Robinson against Steve Robinson Vernon
Smith Lisa Spivey for Linden Stowe Wendy Thomas for Brian Tipper Pam Tracy
Chloe Turner abstain Rob Vines Roger Wyborn Kathy Williams
against.
Susan Williams.
Sorry.
I'm sorry, I've got a cold, haven't I?
So that was Susan Williams against.
Susan Williams against.
Suzanne Williams.
David Willingham.
24, 28 against four abstentions.
Chair - 2:58:44
So the amendments fail, 24 for 28 against in four abstentions.
24.
24.
24.
24.
Was that with me or without me?
I think that was with you, sir.
I think.
Okay, so the Liberal amendments fail.
So now I'm going to move to Labour leader, Councillor John Bloxam.
To put forward your proposal amendments to the budget, please.
John.
Okay, thank you.
So the amendment that we're leaving on the table is the one that
Cllr John Bloxsom - 2:59:20
relates to a continuation of what we've known
into the current council as the Build Back Better Fund, Councillor Fund and has previously
been called the Growing Your Community Together Fund.
So for the last eight years we've had a fund like this that's been really valuable to our
communities. I've certainly been having messages, including yesterday, and I think everybody
got this one, saying we'd like to apply for this fund, it sounds really interesting, and
we've had to say sorry, the fund is currently closed, but we're about to go into a new financial
year, you know, keep an eye on this, please come back to us. It's been
invaluable for grassroots projects as I mentioned earlier on, play groups,
community hubs, environmental projects, local sports clubs, defibrillators for
some of the primary schools in my area, some really useful small -scale things.
These are many, in many cases, these are grassroots projects. They're not a
high level working county wide which tick boxes and address the statutory duties of
the local authority.
But actually on the ground many of these schemes are not visible.
They're just not there.
So we've heard reference to the hubs, family hubs for example.
Well in our district the feedback I'm getting is that they're not visible, they're not up
and running.
They can't recruit staff.
So we need to support grassroots projects as well as big countywide schemes which fit
in with statutory priorities.
These little schemes can help to address the quality of life in a neighbourhood, identity
in the neighbourhood, community cohesion and wellbeing.
That's what small grants can do for little community projects.
I think we've all found that to be of use and of value and I think we should all value
that these schemes should continue in the future.
I'm disappointed that there's nothing in the budget and I hope that after the election,
if there's a new administration, this is one of the things that will be addressed in the
future.
Thank you.
Yeah, thank you for that, John.
Do you have a seconder, please?
Councillor Thomas -Wendy.
Chair - 3:01:36
Right.
Thanks, everyone.
Cllr John Bloxsom - 3:01:40
Yeah, I absolutely want to second this this particular amendment John just don't need to show himself off. There we go
Thank you
Cllr Wendy Thomas - 3:01:48
John just explained some of the joys of this fund and I think
When I think of my four years of being a county counselor the build back better fund has been one of the best things
about the job
Obviously it can support really small initiatives. I've given grants for a couple hundred pounds for a playground. They just needed some tweaking
But one of the joys of this is that as a counselor, we're so often we're in a position of having
to say, no, I'm sorry, that road is never going to be resurfaced.
I'm really sorry, I know there have been accidents on that road but you're not going to get a
crossing.
No, I'm sorry, those potholes are not deep enough.
I know you've just come off your bike and you've got visible injuries.
A lot of what we say to people is, no, I'm sorry, it's not going to be able to happen.
This little pot of money puts us in a position of being able to positively support our communities.
And the range of what we've been able to do is amazing.
I would hope at the end of the four years that we can do a roundup of what we all contributed here,
and every single member in this chamber has spent good money on good projects.
So I really hope there's no excuse not to support this amendment.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, Wendy.
Chair - 3:03:07
So the Labour amendment is forward, so it's open to debate.
Leader of the Council, Councillor Davis.
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 3:03:18
I think we all have sympathy because many of us will have spent money on this budget
on good and useful things.
But I made a couple of comments.
First of all, it wasn't our money.
This was COVID Build Back Better funding
that came centrally, and therefore is a big incremental cost
to our budget if we were to repeat it.
It is also true that when we get to the end of the term,
we will have money unallocated
and we will look at how we best spend that.
But I would also remind you
that we did put extra money into this.
We did it last year for youth services,
not all of which has been spent.
But more recently, we picked,
I'm trying to think most top 10 or top 12, but I think it was the top 10 most deprived areas and gave them additional
Build back better funds. So yes, it's a good thing
But at the cost of half a million pounds that is a responsible decision to take but if we found the money
It was a good scheme. We might find other ways to do it
Yes, first off councillor Hilton
Chair - 3:04:18
Thank you chair and I'm surprised that the conservatives have been so mean when you look
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 3:04:24
at the amount of money they've got in in the balances and I think you know we know the
build back better fund and the other funds whatever the name was have been really useful
for the community that we serve and I'm just looking at some of the projects I've managed
to get funding for that why wouldn't otherwise have done.
I saved Elmscroft Community Centre by making sure that it was made safe and an extension
was demolished and the rest of the community centre was made secure and safe so it's now
in constant use.
I managed to get new heating and redecoration at the main hall at Lonsdale Community Centre,
the church there.
I've managed to secure funding towards new kitchens at St Catherine's at Church Hall.
I've managed to get a new roof to Wootton Tennis Club.
I've managed to provide through this funding swimming lessons for the kids at Keung's own primary school.
The Conservatives want this to stop forever and a day by the look of it.
No wonder they need to be kicked out on May 1st.
And no wonder they were so scared of going to the polls
because they knew they weren't going to have a particularly
good time on the 1st of May.
We know that was the reason.
More than anything else, it's obvious it was the reason.
But I'm really disappointed that I can't support this amendment
because I will.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, Jeremy.
Now have Councillor Spivey.
Lisa.
Thank you.
Chair - 3:05:57
Yeah, I mean, I think this just shows
Cllr Colin Hay - 3:05:59
the difference again between the Conservatives who are happy to spend other
people's money but not happy to invest in the people of Gloucestershire and the
Liberal Democrats and I stand up to you to support not just this amendment to
make a commitment also to you John that if the Liberal Democrats are running
this administration we will be launching the community neighbourhood network
scheme which will do exactly this and we will be putting money in.
The leader practically just said he wasn't gonna put 500 grand in because it
wasn't worth it.
What communities aren't worth it, what are we here to do?
Other than serve our communities,
I literally can't believe it.
Like many of the councillors here today,
I've also had the great pleasure of funding things
that wouldn't have happened.
The Brownies and Maisie Hampton got to go on a trip
that they wouldn't have had.
The village hall in Anthony Cruces
has got solar panels on it now,
saving them money and making that whole
really, really sustainable.
I've invested in a community energy scheme in Kimball.
playgrounds across my
Division have all had improvements made to them and that's thanks to this scheme
So I'm really really happy to support not this amendment to give you a liberal Democrat and a security that we will be
Continuing something of this scheme so that we can actually deliver for our residents and our communities that we really need it
That is the difference people. That is the difference
Thank you for that Lisa next up mark cancer Hawthorne
Chair - 3:07:27
Thank you, Mr Chairman.
Cllr Mark Hawthorne - 3:07:31
Thank you very much for all the amazing praise you've given to the Build Back Better scheme.
The Build Back Better scheme was introduced by this administration.
It was part of our corporate strategy after we won the local elections in 2021.
It was a one -off pot that we gave to every single councillor on this authority, regardless
of their political colour to invest in their local communities, being topped up by this
administration many, many times. Now the only time the Lib Dems have previously discussed
Build Back Better in this council chamber is when they had an emotion a couple of years
ago saying that the money shouldn't be dispersed equally among the 53 councillors and in fact
it should be targeted only at the wards that they felt were important and that needed the
additional help and support. We all remember that debate in this chamber. It was Councillor
Willingham who brought that particular motion into this chamber. It was backed by his group.
But I am pleased that you've seen the light. I am pleased you appreciate the fantastic
change that we've been able to deliver through this Conservative scheme across Gloucestershire
and I'm sure, rest assured, that when the Conservatives are returned once more that
we will be looking once again,
are those who are returned back here
to continue to invest into local communities.
Because we know the true value,
because we're the ones that introduced it
in the first place.
Thank you.
Thank you for that, Mark.
Can I, Councillor Robinson, Steve?
Yeah, thank you, Chair.
Chair - 3:09:04
I'm really disappointed that this fund
Cllr Steve Robinson - 3:09:07
is not gonna carry on.
I was in the chamber when the, prior to COVID,
when it was the growing communities fund that funding was found by the then administration
and I fully support it. Councillor Housden said about the great Albury children's football
I too supported King Stanley Dragons children and families do I go back to them and does
conservative group are not supporting our communities anymore. I've supported
our community hub that bring families in first thing in the morning. They do a
tremendous job, give them five thousand pounds towards that. I'm not going to be
able to fund that anymore, whether that will continue, but I'm you know I'm
really disappointed and I hope that they really think about what they're
with this. Thank you for that Steve. Next I have Councillor Morgan Graham.
Chair - 3:10:15
Yeah thank you chair I don't usually say much in this chamber but some things do
Cllr Graham Morgan - 3:10:19
row me a little bit. As a coaster I'm very grateful for the schemes of whatever
sort they was. They started before Covid and it was about 2017 that we was getting
money and it wasn't from Covid money and always before Marks build back better
scheme but it was all added and it's been good stuff. We've replaced village
all ceilings, it was falling down. In Sinifer today on Miners' Waffle Recreation, there's
throng with kids. It was when I was leaving this morning. They'd been all week in their
shutdown from a scheme that had been paid for by my Build Back Better money. That's
what's happening with that money. And we've just been hearing people crow all morning
about a marvelous count. So we've saved all this money, which is great. But if we don't
continue that scheme, we all, every one of us, be bloody well ashamed of ourselves because
it had done that much good and it had done much good in deprived areas and other areas.
So let's be realistic about it. It had been in a situation where families had been struggling
to make ends meet, charters had been decimated with no money coming in and this had done
a marvellous job and if we can't afford to carry on doing that we ought to be ashamed
of ourselves. Thank you, chair.
Thank you very much.
Councillor Harris.
Joe.
Chair - 3:11:35
Thank you.
Thank you, Chair.
If you'll indulge me very quickly, I'm not going to be at the next
Cllr Joe Harris - 3:11:39
council meeting because
I've got an LGA peer review, so I just wanted to take an opportunity, if I may, to first
of all pay tribute to Mark, who, as we know, is not standing at the next election.
Mark, it's been a great 10 years, 12 years, 12 years getting to know you and, you know,
holding you to account and it's been a lot of fun. So if I don't see you before
the election you know it's been a pleasure. And of course Linden, I understand
Linden isn't standing either. Linden, I think between you and Paul you
introduced me to Punch and Judy politics which I think it's fair to say
has stood me in quite good stead for this count. Haven't quite worked out
which one was Punch and which one was Judy but maybe between the two of
I will find out but no I think it should be noted that your contribution
Particularly to the Cotswolds on our corner of the county regardless of any political
Differences we may have of which there are quite a few it is noted
It is appreciated and you know, we thank you for your service on this side
No, I think this is a
fantastic
amendment which I'm very pleased to
support
You're absolutely right. The Billbough Better funding and its predecessor really gives agency to local county councillors.
Sometimes as a backbench councillor it is quite difficult to find a role for yourself or a niche other than through the scrutiny process.
And this gives backbench councillors in particular a real opportunity to help shape, to help make things happen in local communities.
and of course our communities look to us for leadership.
And when I look at some of my schemes that I've funded,
I've funded everything from the Churn Project,
a fantastic charity in Cirencester
that help people back into work,
help support elderly and vulnerable people,
and indeed have helped my own grandfather,
God bless his soul,
all the way through to the Cirencester
and District Beekeepers Association
to help them with one of their projects.
So I think it's the variety in Build Back Better funding,
which is so great.
And the fact it is pretty liberal
in what we can spend it on, I think that is a good thing.
And I think where possible, we should try and continue it.
So I'd like to thank my colleagues in labor
for bringing this forward.
And I'm very pleased to support it.
So no, credit to you, thank you.
Thank you for that, Joe.
Councillor Willingham, David.
Chair - 3:14:17
Thank you, Chair.
Cllr David Willingham - 3:14:22
Having been named, I think I will correct the record.
So there are two schemes, both of which the Conservatives decided they had to build back
better, because let's just copy central government and power the spin.
And there was the the money that we shamed you into allocating to the areas the 12 areas of deprivation
Because I don't think you would have done that otherwise and there is the money that is allocated equally to everybody and trying to
conflict those
is
wrong
so
This clearly is for each
county councillor to spend in their own areas.
And in my case, the money allocated has gone to things
that will help local children.
For example, supporting the Cheltenham Sea Cadets
on Alston Lane, and also Read With Me,
which my colleague Linda is part of the charity.
And that's actually helping kids in our schools
who are struggling with literacy
to have someone that will read with them.
Something that will make a lifelong difference
and something that we can target to areas where this is a problem
and where people do need that support.
So I'm more than happy to support this amendment.
It's just a shame the others on the other side are not.
Thank you for that David.
David Drew.
Chair - 3:16:00
Councillor, thank you chair and
Cllr David Drew - 3:16:04
We spent a long time today talking about where we will be increasing funding
Of course, this is the one area that is a genuine cut
And it's a very sad cut. I mean we've all got stories that we could tell
About how we've invested in our community with a relatively small sum of money
But it's seed court money and it's kept in my case the hubs going in Stroud Town
Which are vital to those individual communities?
And it's sad and I heard what the leader had to say that there may be some money over
And we'll look again at it
but the reality is
It's very difficult to be a counselor nowadays because the message you give can't do it. There's no money
Sorry, central government won't let us.
This was a, no matter what parties in government,
it is what the message of being a councillor
often has to be about.
And this is something genuinely that people,
and it is checked, there are safeguards
for obvious reasons, takes some time
to get the money through the system,
which is right and proper.
So, notwithstanding whatever happens to this vote,
I hope that whoever's in power after may looks again at this issue
Because it does empower communities, but it also empowers counselors. I
Mean, we've all got our local highways money all I do when I talk to my local. I was off so he said it's all gone
It's already been allocated
You know, sorry, but you know, you'll have to wait next year
Whereas this is genuinely a sum of money that is available and you can do within reason what you want with it
But you and we talked about it. It's about community leadership, but it's about community empowerment
So I hope we will look again at this and try and get something back into what is not just the the meaning
Of being a counselor but the spirit of being able to empower people
Chair - 3:18:11
Thank you David next up councillor stow Linden
Thank you much chair. I don't think anybody this side of the chamber
Cllr Lynden Stowe - 3:18:19
is saying that this isn't a really good scheme
It's been a really good scheme for eight years and both of the last conservative administrations
introduced it in the first year of an administration
administration from available pots of money at the time.
So eight years ago that was done from a public health
surplus and four years ago it was done from covid money.
It is right and proper that a new
administration and hopefully that will be a conservative administration
would would take that decision that some extent that gives those new
members of an administration that money to spend.
Now the total the total sum of money you need is not
500 ,000 you you've got to be honest and say what you need it for four year term
It needs to be again something like two point two million and to fund that you need to work out where that's coming from
But what I can say we mentioned it already today
You know that there is we very much hope there will be an underspend in this year
That'll be a legacy of this administration to the next
It'll then be up to that administration to set those priorities and I for one will be an onlooker then that would be delighted to see
a
continuation of the build back better fund so that each member each division member has that that budget to spend in their
Community, so I think we're all in the same place
The difference is what we're saying at the moment is that it's not the right place to do it
At this point in time the right place to do it is for a new administration
to take that ownership and to probably hopefully probably use some of the
underspend that's coming through which could be done something like this summer
you're up and running you've got your new members that's the way to do it and
but I'm not binding any new administration and I'm not binding you
know to some extent this group going forward but there is an answer that I
hope would satisfy everybody in that there is a I would afford a willingness
us to carry that on and a demand from you and your communities.
Thank you for that Linda. Next I have Councillor Turner -Cloé.
Chair - 3:20:38
Thank you chair. I just wanted really to echo the words of everyone
Cllr Chloe Turner - 3:20:41
else. I do think this
has been a transformative scheme. I funded 32 projects across my division from walking
buses to nature gardens community composting defibrillators
Girls rugby festivals and community woodland management and it has been fantastic to see those projects thrive
So I absolutely support the spirit of this amendment as I did those of the Lib Dems before but I'm an accountant
The pot from which the amendments were due to come has been used up
And it's not clear where this amendment would come from so that that is not a situation
I feel I'm able to vote for so I will be abstaining again
but and I very much hope that as
Councillor Stowe has just suggested there is another opportunity because I do think this is a way that
Local members who really know and understand and want to help their communities can do so in a very practical and achievable way
Thank you for that Chloe next have councillor Mosley Jill
Chair - 3:21:42
Cllr Gill Moseley - 3:21:45
I was under the impression that there was a scheme going back as far as 2012 when I
first became aware of what I would be able to spend. My first introduction to it was
before I was a Councillor to do with the Visually Impaired Peer Support Group that I still support
in Gloucester. We were recipients of some of Councillor, my friend here, David's money
at that point and I rather looked forward to having something the same when I got elected.
I have to say I didn't call it Build Back Better. I chose another name as I advertised
it on my newsletter throughout the ten parishes and at the parish council meetings. In my
time some of the things that I have been very pleased to support are very different from
A heating system at Oxenholme Parish rooms, equipment for the new men's shed,
help for the recycling shop in Newant I could go on, the list is quite long.
But I have spent every last penny.
And I think I want to just re -emphasise that commitment that
Councillor Spivey gave as Liberal Democrats,
that we will keep this scheme when the political administration changes
in May. I'm very happy to support it and I would urge other members to be brave if you're
sitting on the other side of the chamber and to support the amendment because it is something
that's of great value to the community and incidentally to us as councillors. Thank you.
Chair - 3:23:28
Thank you, Jo. I don't have any other members wishing to ask so we will now go to the vote
on the chance to sum up?
Yes.
John, would you like to sum up, please,
before we go to the vote?
Thank you.
Well, it's good to hear the testimony from members
Cllr John Bloxsom - 3:23:47
across the chamber about the good and useful things that
has been done with this funding and its importance
to the communities that we represent.
I did carefully look at the financial implications
sections of the cabinet reports which set this funding up.
In the first one, it definitely says yes, COVID outbreak management fund money, but
there was also a contribution from reserves that were in there as well.
And of course, in the earlier scheme, the growing our communities together that applied
from 2017, we didn't have any COVID outbreak funding because that was pre -COVID.
So there have been times when funding has been found for something like this that clearly
is of value to our communities.
And I'm disappointed that this is not going to be, apparently, supported.
We need to keep it going.
So this is recommending or asking for one -off funding to keep it going for one year.
A new administration can look at the books then and put a long -term scheme in place.
We need to keep this funding going rather than having a long gap where we have to turn
around to people who are asking us this week when can I apply for this money.
We don't have to say oh well, sorry, but if you come back in October or November, maybe a new administration
We've got its act together and we'll have something in place. We need to keep the ball rolling on this
So that's why we put forward this amendment. It's a one -off item
It gives us ten thousand per division, which is the equivalent of the old scheme which gave us forty thousand over four years
So we believe this issue will be continued. It's very modest
But it will be widely welcome within our communities as members from all sides of the chamber have said and I hope everybody will feel
Able to support this amendment. Thank you
Thank you John
Chair - 3:25:38
So now we will go to the vote on the amendment from labor
Those four there's gates those to abstain on to Steven to call your names to vote
Even read out the names note
Democratic Services - 3:25:54
four against abstain Carol Alloway Martin okay Matt Babbage Paul Baker for
John blotsam for David Brown for Alistair Chambers
against. Kate Cody. Linda Cohen. Stephen Davies. Against. David Drew. Born. Ben Evans. Born.
Stefan Feithfeld against. Bernie Fisher for Andrew Gravels. David Gray against.
Terry Hale. Tim Harmon. Joe Harris for Mark Horforn. Colin Hay. Alex Hegenbach.
Jeremy Hilton, Stephen Hurst, Paul Hodgkinson, Nick Housden, against, Becky Hoyland, upstate, Mark Mackenzie -Charington, against, Chris McFarlane, against, Paul McLean, against,
Andrew Miller against Graham Morgan or Morris against Jill Mosley for Emma
Nelson Dave Norman such Patel Allen priest bill Robinson against Steve
Robinson Vernon Smith Lisa Spivey or Lyndon Stowe Wendy Thomas for Brian
Tipper Pam Tracy Chloe Turner abstain Rob Vines Roger Wyborn Kathy Williams
again.
Susan Williams, again.
Suzanne Williams, again.
David Willingham, again.
Thank you members.
The third amendment fails on 24.
Chair - 3:28:24
28 against, 4 abstentions.
So we now go to the substantive motion of the budget for general debate.
20. You tried saying it.
Yes. It's 20. No, it's 20 in favour. There were 20 in favour of the amendment, 28 against
the amendment and four abstentions. Yes. We're good?
Jeremy yeah, can't say Hilton
Are we starting the debate?
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 3:29:11
Because I just wanted to say I can see why marks now
Chair - 3:29:13
Decided to step down and retire from the County Council because he's getting confused about things. He supported in the past
He was criticizing
us for arguing the case that some divisions needed additional support
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 3:29:29
because there were areas of
deprivation
Matson Robinson was one Westgate Kings along with them St. Peter's and others around the county
We moved a motion for council to argue that point and interestingly
We then had a conference of which mark
Announced so I think one and a half million pound for all these things. So he was keen to do it then
and
And my division got £150 ,000, I think, to deal with issues of deprivation.
And I targeted it in the area around Clapham, which is the super output area.
And surprisingly, only a few weeks ago, I got another email from the administration
from Stephen Davis saying, you can have another £30 ,000, which I've allocated for works to
done at King's Own Primary School that has got a lot of kids from those sort of backgrounds.
So that's a totally different situation to the Build Back Back Up. I think you called
it Levelling Up Together Fund. And it was targeted at some of those. So I think Mark
needs to correct that statement and apologise for trying to mislead this council because
he did support the additional funds to be targeted at areas where there were families
of people living in deprived communities or whether they were hard up or there were social
problems that he needed dealing with. He supported it, he actually proposed the money. He made
a great sum in that about it at the conference we had. He tried to surprise everybody about
how wonderful he was and now he doesn't want to provide a penny for these sort of projects
and that surprises me. No wonder you're stamping down and maybe you're just demob -happy at
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 3:31:23
point. Thank you Councillor Hilton. Next I have Councillor Evans. Ben.
Chair - 3:31:30
Yeah I just
Cllr Ben Evans - 3:31:34
wanted to speak about the money that's been allocated, the amendment that's been
accepted about youth work and work with young people because I'm really pleased
it's happened but it's also massively illustrative of what we keep banging on
about. About how you invest in certain things, you save yourself money and if
don't you cost yourself a lot of money. So Stowe Youth Club is called club and I
might be one number out here it's called Club 66 or Club 67 and Chipping Camden
Youth Club I think was Club 69. Do you know why they were called that? Because
it's a 66th youth club in the county and I think Chipping Camden was 69. How many
are left? Five, six possibly and those are bases mainly for staff. So in in 2011
Brockworth Youth Club had 150 young people attending
every single week, including up to 50 on a Friday evening
on a project that was deliberately there
to stop antisocial behaviour.
On a Wednesday afternoon, we were working
with the local schools who were working with them
with their most at risk of exclusion year eights.
Eight of them.
That's completely gone.
Because what's happened under this conservative
of administration is, they cut things that are preventative,
measures to the quick, and then they brag
that we've increased children's services spending
by 60 % since 2019, as if that's something
to be pleased about, that we're now costing people more.
We're costing people more.
They don't talk about outcomes,
they don't talk about what they've achieved.
It's the only metric you have if we've managed
to spend more of the council taxpayer's money.
In Brockworth now, there's a youth club which is run
and funded as there is in Churchdown by the parish council.
So guess what?
People in Churchdown and Brockworth are getting charged
twice to provide that service.
And so whilst I'm really pleased that finally,
finally, way too late, the Conservatives are accepting
an amendment that says we're gonna try and intervene
a little bit earlier.
Let's try and intervene before these kids hit the
youth justice system, before they get excluded from school.
Finally you're doing it, but it's just illustrative
of how 20 years of complete financial mismanagement,
complete mismanagement of services.
Because me, if I'm completely honest,
and I understand the financial bit,
but if I'm completely honest,
what I'm interested in is young people and children.
And that their outcomes for them are really positive.
That's the number one aim for me.
But I'd be stupid if I didn't see
there's also a massive financial payout to that,
if you could intervene earlier.
And so whilst I am grateful that it has been accepted,
the amendment's been accepted,
it's a shame it had to be an amendment,
and I just think it's illustrative again
of this whole conservative project,
which has been to see the cost of everything,
the value of nothing, and to not put the money in
at a dew point which would stop then
this ridiculous runaway spending that you've overseen.
Ben, if you could.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Chair - 3:34:39
Cllr Ben Evans - 3:34:42
Next on my list I have Councillor Harman.
Tim.
Thank you, Chairman.
Chair - 3:34:48
I'm delighted to support the budget.
Cllr Ben Evans - 3:34:51
We must be relieved as members that we're not here debating hour after hour how we're
going to cut budgets, which they're doing in many councils near us, whether they're
Cllr Emma Nelson - 3:35:01
going to close libraries.
We're not closing libraries.
Whether they're going to make staff redundant, whether they're going to get rid of lollipop
People lots of counts as doing that because they've not been well well
Cllr Tim Harman - 3:35:10
and managed. We are in a far stronger position
Some mention was made here on of such songs by the Stranglers and Chris Rhea
Roads, but seems to me if we'd accepted what they said over there. It lost you'll be on the road to ruin
So probably what we ought to focus on is now a clear message that we are here for the people in this county to deliver
For the people in this county include the most vulnerable
But what I want to speak to specifically today is the additional investment in SEN, Special
Educational Needs.
And I note a new school is coming.
How different this is to when I first entered this chamber way back in 2005 when we had
succeeded a sort of coalition of Labour and Liberal Democrats who had put the special
schools then, Alderman Knight in Chuxbury and Belmont in Cheltenham, under threat.
Councilor Smith remembers it well, and you remember her and the big campaign by the parents
to keep it open.
When we came in, in that administration, Barry Derr is our leader, the first act we did was
to keep those schools open and we've invested in them consistently.
That is the difference between this council and what the alternative would be.
And I'll be very interested in a few minutes when we vote to see how the parties over there
Vote when we look at the budget that would deliver that additional investment will they support it or will they not? Thank you chairman
Thank you
Next upon my list is councillor Cody Kate
Chair - 3:36:40
Thank You chair
Cllr Cate Cody - 3:36:45
As in previous years entire budget may not be quite as green as we'd like to see it
but we're aware that most of the funding is going into statutory services and there is a finite pot of funding.
However, I'd still like to mention a few items of note that we do fully support within the proposed budget.
So within children and families, growing youth support and the newly commissioned PAWS model as mentioned earlier.
In public health, new work on infection prevention control and an anti -microbial stewardship action plan,
Plus ongoing work to tackle domestic abuse and supporting the health and well -being of refugees
within economy environment and infrastructure positives include seeking new funding opportunities to further decarbonize the estate
Making a road and safety and traffic officer role permanent tree funding
Dmmo staffing support and further investment in find and fix and community speed watch
In community safety, a permanent standards coordinator post.
And finally, in capital budget, also referenced earlier,
the building of three new adult care homes,
plus bridges and structures investment,
including a walk bridge, natural flood management work,
procurement of electric vehicles
across various directorates,
and increased investment in the maintenance
of our unclassified road network.
Our mission as Greens is to instigate real change. We're a group that's happy to cooperate with other parties and we gladly shared our amendments with all three of the other party leaders.
We're really pleased to have had our amendments incorporated and we support the two additions, recognising further funding for flooding and extra provision for children.
The combination of which have used the entire pot allocated for amendments. We will be supporting this year's budget. Thank you
Thank you for that Kate
Next I have councillor Harris Joe
Chair - 3:38:46
Thank you very much. Well Tim in answer to your question
I'm very clear that I'm going to be voting against this budget. I'm
Absolutely certain in why I'm doing that because I don't believe it is right
residents in this county are having to pay more when services continue to decline.
And we heard it earlier, didn't we? We heard it. Oh, you keep going on about the potholes, you keep going on about the roads.
Well, for most people, it is the number one issue they look to their council to try and solve.
And for most residents, it is the most visible sign of how badly things have gone.
If I look at my own area, Phoenix Way, Summerford Road,
Cllr Joe Harris - 3:39:28
Cranham's Lane, Bournton Lane, some examples of where
they're not just potholes, but they are craters.
It's unacceptable.
So for me, I can't look residents in the face and say,
well, we want to charge you more council tax
when I know that nothing's gonna get better.
And that's on top of the 75 % rise in council tax
since 2005 under this administration.
I can't look residents in the eye and vote for this budget for that reason.
And just on that, we need a cultural change as well and we need a change in policy.
These guys have negotiated a bad highways contract with no common sense in.
We've seen it, haven't we? We've seen examples of where a crew will turn up, they'll fill in the crater,
and the one next to it they leave totally unfilled. It's bonkers, it's totally mad.
And then we get cries from this side, all they seem to say is, oh report it, report it, report it.
We are reporting it, the problem is the policies that you guys have implemented,
the contract that you've negotiated, means it's not policy compliant.
So it's just left there to get even worse and even worse.
It's bonkers. It's totally mad. So Tim enough to your point
I can quite confidently say hand on heart why I am voting
against this budget because I don't think it is right that council tax goes up year after year after year at this
Authority and services seem to decline and decline and decline. It's not fair and residents deserve better
Thank you for that Joe next up councillor gravel sundry
I'm going to ask you to speak.
I'm going to ask you to speak.
Chair - 3:41:11
I wasn't going to speak and I'll be very brief.
seat34* - 3:41:17
About five hours ago, Councillor Haynes said
something like this is a budget from an
administration which is run out of steam and
ideas.
I think in the last five hours we proved just the
opposite.
Cllr Andrew Gravells - 3:41:26
We haven't run out of steam, we haven't run out
of ideas and we have a lot more original ideas
than you have on that side of the House.
You continually go on about potholes as if
That's the only thing that you're going to campaign on.
I'm pleased that my group and one of the independents
has spoken about the SCN school which is being built.
That is a fantastic opportunity for us as an authority
to give younger children a,
sorry, I thought Lisa was trying to speak,
the best opportunity to get a great start in life.
And some of the credit for the successful way
that's gone through cabinet, planning committee,
and being passed by planning committee some of the credit for that has to go to my colleague Phil Robinson who
Right from the outset took me into his confidence and said Andrew this hasn't yet gone through cabinet
But as a local member, I want to give you a heads up. What's your take? I'm
Listening to Phil for just five six minutes
I knew instinctively that that was an idea that I should get right behind and that's why I supported it
I spoke to the cabinet members and said we need to need to do some public
Consultation on this and I think one or two of them said well the moment and should we've got nothing to consult on
And I said people are suspicious. They think that they will think that we've got it all cooked up
That's I'm sure we all get this. Well, what's the point of going to planning? It's all decided
You know what's going to happen?
So we did a lot of consultation until thank you for that that you came to some of those events and thank you to my
colleagues in the cabinet.
Thanks to their efforts collectively, we hit the
issues that we were getting from the objectors head on.
I'm still in touch with some of the objectors and some
of the objections that they had are still capable of resolution.
So, this is why I'm supporting this budget
because it's sensible, it's sound, and above all,
it's solvent.
And in addition, young children and young children
and older people right across the age spectrum
will get a good deal and it's very inclusive from
All of the work and the effort and the finances that my colleagues are sensibly putting into this budget
I recommend the budget to the council and I hope it will be supportive. Thank you
Thank you Andrew next I have councillor Fisher burning
Chair - 3:43:42
Thank You chair
Cllr Bernard Fisher - 3:43:46
I won't support budget and
From the other side the house we've heard
All you go on about is potholes
That's what the press goes on about, the Automobile Association, the RAC, the residents of my
division and other divisions.
I am a car user, I drive.
As I come along an A road to come here, coming out of Blakeney, there is a pothole that the
They failed to notice that it's got a water leak underneath it.
They failed to notice it, so I informed them through FixMyStreet.
No acknowledgement. It's been fixed on a monthly basis for the last five months.
Because either it's a water course or there is a 7Trent water leak,
which we haven't got one of the service people to do.
It's not about what you spend, it's how you spend it.
And you don't spend it wisely.
You put temporary traffic lights up for an accident that happened two weeks ago last Friday.
First of all they were wrecked by somebody hitting them with their HTV, by the look of it.
And then you put them back up and it was a day's work.
But the traffic lights were there for a fortnight which we were paying for
You invest your money wisely and on investment you have a reserve
Now I have a reserve is called my savings account with the nationwide
Now that's there for rainy days
And things that I can't afford to do out of my local budget
my monthly budget of income to fix, like if the chimney needs repointing.
And that's what you do, and that's why you should be investing in the local build back better out of reserves.
It's not going to break the reserves, our reserves have increased.
And reserves are for a rainy day.
And if you haven't noticed, it's raining.
Thank you for that Bernie
Next I have councillor. Hey Colin
Chair - 3:46:16
Thank You chair carry on with the potholes
Cllr Colin Hay - 3:46:25
Actually, I'm not going to you you're you're you're saved I'm going to talk about a
road in my in my patch and the tree had to come down so it was cut down and
then it had the
You'll have seen them all over the place, the red and white plastic barriers.
And I rang my Highways local manager again about this.
A year later, with the barriers flat and all rubbish there and everything else, and he couldn't remember it,
And so he went to see exactly where I was talking about.
And he said, oh my god, it's on Google Earth,
these red barriers.
They'd been there so long.
A year.
How long do these things have to wait to be fixed?
The other thing is a repair on Wadden Road.
I reported it, and I measured it.
So it was more than a golf ball deep, you know,
And all this sort of thing. It was shaking the houses on either side when a bus went over and
I said this really needs fixing and they fixed it
They put a strip of tarmac down the center of it with two holes either side
And I said to my house money. This is useless
He said yeah, it actually needs a patch repair
Why the hell do it in the first place if you know that that's what's got to be done
And he said, but you're going to have
to wait because we haven't got any money now.
You're going to wait for the new financial year.
What a waste of money.
Just, you know, it's money being thrown down the drain, which
is probably why the drains can't take the amount of water
that they should be.
So it's not a question.
What is happening is that, yes, they're fixing it
for five minutes at a time.
They don't last.
Get real, get somebody who can get a grip on that
contract and actually get value for money for once,
which we're not getting currently,
of this administration.
That's what you need.
You need people that believe in contract
management and instil in staff that it makes a
difference, and it will make a difference with the
clean and green, and actually making things
look better because people will feel as if this county cares about their residents for
once rather than leaving things deteriorating right across the county.
It's time for a change.
We need to recognize the views of our residents and work for them to make this, again, a glorious
Gloucestershire.
Thank you, Colin.
Chair - 3:49:22
Next, I've got Councillor Preece.
Hello
Chairman, thank you a while ago in this chamber
I think it was counts to Drew and counts to Morgan put a motion
Cllr Alan Preest - 3:49:30
forward on flood which we all
Supported a very valuable motion and since then this authority is a lead local flood authority
I particularly done some excellent job down in the forest and in the lindy catchment area, so I'm very pleased to see this
Amendment today that puts extra money flood into the into the budget
But what I would like to say is there was an exceptional storm as we know event on the
24th, 25th, 26th of November.
Lydney suffered like many other towns and villages suffered in Gloucestershire.
That's still going on but there is a tremendous amount of work going on.
We've got a special visit as the chairman knows to Lydney next week.
But again following that event, on the following Friday coincidentally and following Councillor
Odkinsons motion we had a good presentation by
environment scrutiny committee by
Thames water and seven Trent
Highlighting what's going on? And I think we put that additional money in but not this in the budget statement
but we need to educate our local planning authorities on flu Ville on flu Ville and
Ensure that our local residents are protected
So we don't have to worry about putting extra money in there because proper planning
Due diligence has not been followed. So I welcome I'll know that the people of lydney will welcome this extra money
I would like to thank James and Joe Baker in the the local flood authority of this authority for the exceptional work
They've been doing. Thank you chairman
Thank you for that Helen
Next I've cancer Hawthorne mark
Chair - 3:51:10
Cllr Alan Preest - 3:51:13
I'm just doodling here.
Vote contract management, vote Colin Hay.
Cllr Carole Allaway Martin - 3:51:19
Maybe I have finally found a reason
that the Lib Dems exist.
I'm not sure that's going to be quite a catchy leaflet.
Cllr Mark Hawthorne - 3:51:28
You might want to rethink that one.
One of the reasons I wanted to stand up, actually,
and Ben's gone, sadly, so he's not going to hear me
maybe teach him in on a little bit of history
about the youth service in this country.
It was actually an all party report back in 2010 led by the then liberal Democrat, Dennis
Andrew Arthur, that looked at the universal youth provision offer in Gloucestershire.
And as part of that piece of work, what they did was identify that actually the county
council's youth service was shrinking in the number of children it was reaching.
And actually, by a factor of three, more children were being reached by the voluntary sector
across Gloucestershire.
And that a lot of the budget that we had for youth provision
back then wasn't actually going into youth provision at all.
It was going into propping up buildings that were
very much beyond end of life.
And it was a collective decision that we made in this council
chamber during austerity.
Just remember when you were actually in government
and we actually had to face in -year cuts, something
I don't think we've ever faced before or since in our grant
funding that we took the decision to move away from a universal youth
provision to one that was about supporting the voluntary sector and
putting money into there. And we had fantastic schemes where local communities
could take over those local buildings and many of those local buildings that
used to be youth centres are being transformed into community hubs right
across the county. But sadly Ben's gone so he's going to miss that entire
teaching which actually explains why we've got the services that we have
But I do think it's really, really important that anybody who's going to be knocking on the doors in the coming weeks and months
just pays very much attention to what they're about to do.
Because you've got on a doorstep and you've got a residence that says, I've got a pothole, you need to be spending more money on potholes,
then you've got to be voting for this budget today.
because this budget is putting an extra 10 million pounds into roads across Gloucestershire
and that is only possible, that is only possible because of the financial prudence of this authority over the last 20 years.
And we are a council that's investing right across the board when so many of our contemporaries are having to make horrendous cuts
and if you only need to look at Somerset to look at what they've had to do for their local residents.
Not only are they cutting services, they are having to increase council tax by 7 .9 % just to make the books balance.
So if you're thinking about what you're going to say when that resident says to you,
what have you done to ensure that there's enough money to fill in pot holes?
You need to turn around and say to them, I voted for this budget, so I'm voting for more money into our roads,
more money into our public services and more money into the residents
Chair - 3:54:23
of Gloucestershire. Thank you.
Thank you
Next have a one less councillor chambers Alistair
Thank You chair
Cllr Alastair Chambers - 3:54:37
Council official made a point that it's always in the press. That's why they're going on about potholes
Councillor Haye was saying about the potholes issues, but looking at the budget amendment can only see a clean and green gang local cycleway
Funding for pedestrian crossings that advice I can't really see there's nothing there for bottles in our amendment
so they're so keen about amendment or they put in as a clean agreement, which is
Those that you might not have looked into it. It's basically a ready -made box of
Aggregate that pork gets poured in it's not a proper cutout. It's not a proper asphalt tar
Repair, so the stuff that the very thing they're complaining about the Liberals in this budget is the very thing they haven't included
So maybe if they had included it might have been looked at but they had they don't know they just completely fail to include it
Is that what they're gonna do with their budget within two feet in charge if they're in charge
It's missing things that is terrible. Not only that
Counselor hey made a point about they fill a hole and they don't come back till later to do a proper job
Well, the reason being is is it's about tolerances if the tolerance is over 40 million more than 300 mil wide
It then comes down to a an urgent repair
So they have to use a quick aggregate to repair it so people don't get killed and people don't get hurt
So what they're doing actually is the correct way of doing it and then when they can do the road closure and cut it out
And break it out and do it repair it properly. That's what they got to do road closures take time booking takes time
So it's actually been done correctly and looking at these amendments and the Liberals
What is the biggest most important thing that this County Council does compared to districts?
Child care and adult service business. They've not got one thing in here about it at all. Not one thing
the most complex care, people that need the most care,
people that have got dementia,
people that got learning difficulties,
people that have got mental health conditions.
They've not mentioned anything
about the most vulnerable in our county.
Out of 660 ,000 people, the biggest budget spent
in our county council is those for adult services
and child services.
They've not mentioned anything.
And that to me is absolutely appalling.
Shame on you, really, shame on you, thank you.
Thank you for that, Alistair.
Next I have Councillor Norman Dade.
Chair - 3:56:44
Thank you, Mr Chairman.
I am very quick, conscious of time, but it would be wrong of me not to say why this budget
Cllr Dave Norman - 3:56:53
is right for my portfolio area, because over the last five years there has been significant
investment in your fire and rescue service.
You've only got to look at those figures. Where other fire authorities currently
are having to go through closes of stations and reduction in firefighters,
we are doing the complete opposite. We have moved in that way. We've recognized
the challenges that came out of His Majesty's inspections and I'm positive
that that's going to be reflected in the next week to ten days. So this budget is
right for your fire and rescue service therefore it's right for the residents
of Gloucestershire as is again in my portfolio extra money to enter community
speed watch and again there's going to be some more very interesting points
coming out on the back of the cabinet panel I've recently chaired which was
cross party we all agreed that it needed to be more positive moving forward we're
doing that we're looking at speeds we're looking at crossings and just to correct
Councillor Spivey she obviously hasn't looked at the most recent data. There was actually a reduction in KSI in
2024 Thank You chairman
Thank You councillor Norman
Any other members wish to speak on the main debate?
Chair - 3:58:20
councillor why board
Cllr Roger Whyborn - 3:58:27
Very quick one because I feel obliged to intervene on the that has been said
loads of times that there's nothing in our budget amendments about the potholes
and of course because that's complete bunking. The three find and fix
gangs, yes I can read what's in the narrative because I had a hand in
writing it but the primary task of finding the fixed gangs is to repair
potholes and defects on the road. The idea is great but we haven't got enough of them.
You know going down roads every day and just finding them like car tracks.
Thank you. Thank you. Thanks that Roger
Chair - 3:58:59
Any other members wishes to speak in the main debate cancer has done Nick
Thank you chair. I didn't get any of this times must be doing something right on the day
Cllr Nick Housden - 3:59:06
Mr. Chairman, I'm slightly
What this point at all concerned but so I understand that
politicians on all sides of this room will have things that they want in the budget and not and
We all have different views on the exact makeup of it
But the bit that I struggle with here is to vote against this budget is to vote against
the new SEND school.
That is outrageous.
I mean, if you take away all of the things that you'd like included, you know, there
are people in this room considering voting against building a SEND school.
That is actually outrageous.
On second point on that is that also in this budget, and I've already mentioned it, but
there's three new care homes to be built.
So if this budget fails today because people vote against it, you are voting against building
three care homes.
Like this is not political point scoring or just people trying to make a point.
Like this is genuinely important stuff that people care about and affects people's lives.
The send waiting list, okay, there's two million quid in this budget to help reduce that waiting
list.
If you vote against this budget, those young people won't get the support they need.
I think that's actually outrageous to suggest because you want something on your leaflets or to score some points or because you want to have a
They get the the group run the council for many years that it's okay to vote against this budget
You attempt to get
Amendments for and if you do great if you don't then that's fine
But at the end of the day we should all be coming around the table and voting for this budget and anyone in this room
He doesn't vote for this budget. I genuinely feel should be ashamed
I
Thanks for that Nick any other members wishing to speak before I go to councillor start head councillor drew David
Chair - 4:00:49
Just respond to my new neighbor to say
Look, there's much in this budget most of its budget the vast majority we would agree on
but we have brought forward amendments that have not been accepted and
Cllr David Drew - 4:01:08
We are duty bound because of the nature of the democratic process
to make a point that we think those amendments
should have been included.
Now we can argue how they were gonna be funded
and that maybe is part of the process
that we have to look at in a different way
in a different time.
But it's about politics
and politics is about making decisions.
And those decisions where we can agree, we will agree,
but we're disagreeing on the nature of the amendments
that the administration have refused to accept.
And that is a point that can only be reflected
when you vote in a particular way.
Otherwise, we might as well all say,
well, the budget just goes through without any debate,
because we've all agreed it.
Well, that's patently not true,
because the amendments that have been brought forward
by the Liberal Democrat group and the Labour group
have not been accepted.
And therefore we are duty -bound to reflect that so it's not about the whole budget. It's about the way in which
Amendments have not been given fair and proper
Understanding and we can only do something about that by casting our votes in a particular way
Chair - 4:02:29
Thank you David any members wishing to speak before I call on Councillor stowed to sum up the budget
Before we go to the vote councillor stop
Thank you very much Sherman
I'm can I thank everybody for the those of you who are going to
Cllr Lynden Stowe - 4:02:42
support the budget today and even if you don't support it
For those for those who supported in spirit but not politically up a few points
I just want to touch on the pick the issue of reserves
There's a bit of a home truth. There is already five million pounds in this budget coming out of reserves
So you your proposals were going to increase that further now the reason our reserves are currently at
33 million is because that represents 5 % of our overall revenue net budget
And that is what sit there who consider to be a prudent approach. That's why we've got that level of reserves
three of your counts as a Cotswold
Quite ironic to see up there a proposal from you around
introducing a funding for clean and green you scrapped clean and green a few
months ago at Cotswold because you've run out of money. When we look at a few
history lessons Joe you said you asked me the questions it's one of the
questions today what's been the increase in council tax at GCC since 2005 the
answer is 75 % what CPI been since 2005 the answer 75 % so what do you expect you
your services inevitably are going to go up with inflation.
But if we talk about council tax increase,
let us never forget what was happening in about 2003.
Jeremy certainly won't.
Here, the council tax in one year,
this is when inflation was running at about 2%.
Council tax here went up 13 % in one year.
So don't forget that.
That's what happens under a liberal Democrat administration,
Or one that has liberal Democrats involved in it
So finally chairman, I would just like to propose again that the budget in front of you. I'm highlighting those three
Extra figures as amendments in case they haven't been clocked. That's the
500 ,000 the
430 flood alleviation 430 for children's services and the list of green amendments as presented area. Thank you very much chairman
Thank you for that Lyndon. So now we will go to the recorded vote for the full budget.
Chair - 4:05:00
I'll hand over to Stephen for those in favour against or abstentions. Stephen.
So as before I will read out your names.
Democratic Services - 4:05:13
Carol Alloway Martin.
Matt Babbage.
Paul Baker.
Abstain.
John Bloxham against David Brown abstain Alistair Chambers Kate Cody Linda Cohen
Steven Davies for David Drew Ben Evans
He's gone.
Stefan Feiffeld.
For.
Bernie Fisher.
Against.
Andrew Gravels.
For.
David Gray.
For.
Terry Hale.
For.
Tim Harmon.
For.
Joe Harris.
Against.
Mark Hawthorne.
For.
Colin Hay.
Again.
Alex Hegenbach Jeremy Hilton
Abstain Stephen Hurst
Paul Hodgkinson Against
Nick Housden For
Becky Hoyland Mark McKenzie -Charrington
For Chris MacFarlane
Paul MacLean For
Andrew Miller for Graham Morgan against Don Morris
Jill Mosley abstain Emma Nelson
Dave Norman
such Patel
Alan priest Phil Robinson for Steve Robinson
Vernon Smith
Lisa Spivey.
Linda Stowe.
Wendy Thomas.
Brian Tipper.
Pam Tracy.
Chloe Turner.
Rob Vines.
Roger Wyborn.
Kathy Williams.
Susan Williams
Suzanne Williams David William, okay
Okay, so the members the budget passes by 32 members for
Chair - 4:07:50
50 13 members against and six abstentions so the budget is carried
Now move on to item 9.
Members questions for class members?
There's 63, so try and be succinct.

9 Members' Questions

We've got 30, 45 minutes for this item.
Question 1.
Councillor Hilton, Jeremy.
Do you have a question, Ray?
I do.
Chair - 4:08:35
I was just waiting for the Chamber to settle down and some to leave.
I thank the leader for his non -answer.
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:08:42
Is it not the case that on the publication of the English devolution white paper you saw the opportunity to
Suspend the elections in May and to extend your mandate well belong its cell day day cell by day
Will you now apologize to the people of the county for your cynical attempt to stop the democratic process and remove?
Remove the right for residents to pass judgment on your administration
Later the council
I was going to thank you for your question, Jeremy,
Chair - 4:09:12
but I won't.
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:09:13
No, I won't apologize.
I was trying to do a very simple thing.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:09:18
It's very interesting now we're getting into the
detailed discussions about how we get to unitary.
People are going, oh, that's going to take a long time.
It'll be a long time before we manage to get to a
combined authority and attract funding,
which is, funnily enough, what I said
when I wrote to the minister.
People think it was about the 800 ,000 pound
of the cost of the election.
I think that's fairly low on the list,
but the number one reason was actually
disruption to staff and we're already having that concern that says how do you
attract and retain staff in a situation where we are years away from completing
this. We're a year further away than we could have been but the Minister didn't
agree with me actually didn't agree with many authorities who asked to have it
delayed. I am looking forward to the election I think we've just seen what
excellent track record we have and an excellent budget so bring it on.
Question 2, Jeremy, do you have a supplementary?
Yeah, I do.
Chair - 4:10:11
This is about the minimum population of a strategic authority that is
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:10:15
in the white paper.
And I'm surprised the leader of this council doesn't have the confidence to argue the case
that Gloucestershire County Council is large enough to be the strategic authority in its
own right.
and he's rolled over to the government agenda immediately.
The population of this county is similar to the country of Luxembourg.
It's also a similar population to Tees Valley Combined Authority.
Why are you so timid with your leadership?
Leader.
Chair - 4:10:52
Because I can read and I read the exam question.
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:10:53
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:10:54
And the exam question is incredibly clear as set by a Labour government.
I could and over beer sometimes a movie could argue whether there is the right exam question
But I did read the exam question and I'm answering the exam question set by central government
But you're not prepared to ask answer my question because it's a question
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:11:13
Yeah question three
Chair - 4:11:17
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:11:18
In order to have a Stephen Davis's quick fix and have a single unitary done overnight
It would require that this council doubles its membership from the 55 were expected in May
That would be 110 councillors.
We've seen today in this council chamber.
The chamber's almost full and not everybody's here.
How on earth are we gonna get another 55 councillors
in this chamber?
Just spent a million pound on it.
So tell me, how would you accommodate 110 councillors
as soon as in your quick fix council?
Leader of the council.
Chair - 4:11:55
So Jeremy, first of all, we are in the early stages of this.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:11:59
We haven't actually resolved exactly what we will do in the next set of elections.
I guess that's yet to be decided.
But you're right, it looks like we'll go for doubled up councillors.
And it actually says in the answer, currently 605, so we're getting pretty close, and we
can look at what modifications are made.
But let's be serious.
We are not going to decide how many unities we have by the size of a council chamber.
We're going to do it by what's good for the citizens of Gloucestershire in terms of financially running one council
We're going to not create a doughnut around Gloucester to suit Jeremy Hilton. We're gonna do what sensible
Thank you leader
Chair - 4:12:42
Question five Jeremy Java supplementary to five no
Thank you
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:12:48
Question six, do you have a supplementary to six?
Chair - 4:12:52
Seven, Lisa.
Nine, okay, question nine, please.
Yeah, thank you, and I thank the leader for answering many, many, many questions.
Cllr Colin Hay - 4:13:06
Seems to be a bit of a void over there, so you're filling, Stephen.
Number nine, yeah.
Can you confirm that the bridge mentioned in the
response is the GCC -owned bridge, which has had
scaffolding on it for at least the last 10 years,
and is therefore once again hampering road safety by
not tackling an issue and taking proactive steps to
deal with an issue?
I don't have the details to confirm that to you, but I
will make sure we get back to you.
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:13:40
And I do understand actually that Jeremy answers all his own questions anyway City Council
Chair - 4:13:52
Cllr Colin Hay - 4:14:03
Yes, so I know in the response you see and still includes quality monitoring and also
Cllr Lisa Spivey - 4:14:14
that you, and also that you say that regular auditing happens. I wondered if
Cllr Colin Hay - 4:14:18
you could just break that down because still including is not the lived
experience certainly on this side of the chamber where we see you know regularly
as you have heard today potholes filled in and then refilled in a couple of
weeks later because all the tarmac has crumbled on the side of the road so I
just wondered what that specific criteria was and what regular auditing
Means as far as I'm aware that we am hold I think was it 10 % of all work carried out and I guess with
80 ,000 potholes that's quite a lot. But yeah, just just a bit further detail in that case
So in the time at this point in the day and without having the knowledge at my fingertips
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:14:54
I'm not going to give you detail but we can provide you that I think you may well have had it actually when we took this
Food scrutiny as a decision to recommission it. So I think you might have had the information but if you haven't I'll double -check
Question 11, Lisa. Yes, thank you.
Chair - 4:15:11
Cllr Lisa Spivey - 4:15:13
Actually, sorry, question 13, next one, Vernon, please.
So your response to question 13 implies that sign cleaning and clearing is an add -on to
the multimillion pound contract. Is that correct, that regular cleaning and
clearing of signage is not actually included in the multimillion pound contract?
Thank you
So if you read the answer it says clearing of vegetation of science is
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:15:40
still an item for GCC to order in additional cost
Yes, but doesn't mean we don't do it. Obviously we do it on a as -needed basis
Which goes back to fix my streets, which if you report it, then we will be able to know to do it
Thank you for that question 14 Paul
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Chair - 4:16:02
Yes, please.
Thank you, Stephen.
Cllr Paul Baker - 4:16:07
You won't know the answer to my supplementary, but if you can get back to me, because this
is an increasing problem across the county.
Only yesterday in Barkey Street, yellowlining was done and the stuff has all been left,
some of the stuff has been left behind.
Can you let me know how many fines have been levied for failure to collect this equipment
after work has been completed?
And what level of fines are we talking about? Thank you
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:16:37
290 ,000 fines have been levied by the street works team. I'm just trying to think but year -to -date, okay
100 ,000 pounds worth of fines year -to -date
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:16:48
Chair - 4:16:50
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:16:51
Council Baker question 15
Chair - 4:16:58
Thank you
Chair - 4:17:03
Question 16, that's a Harris. Do you have a supplementary job? Yeah. Thank you
Year after year residents in my division in siren sister have been
Cllr Joe Harris - 4:17:10
asked to pay more in council tax
With bandy household seeing their bills rise by over 75 percent since 2006
This is an average increase of 3 % a year and yet despite these relentless hikes our roads are in the worst state
They've ever been in riddled with potholes crumbling services and dangerous conditions for motorists cyclists and pedestrians alike
How can the council justify hitting residents with them with another near 5 % increase?
For the next financial year when it has so clearly failed to deliver even the most basic services like maintaining our roads
Chair - 4:17:50
Later the council I would never want to sound in any way complacent
Cllr Joe Harris - 4:17:51
that we are fixing the pothole problem
But we are clearly fixing more potholes for that money this year than last year and we can provide you with the figures on that
We're also being more responsive
I mentioned fix my streets before and we could also point that every
Council including the one that he runs has increased by similar amounts and
Faced with inflation and demand increase in certain areas
It's unlikely that we're going to massively improve the services that are increased the services
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:18:21
We are very pleased with the state that we reach with them at the moment
Thank you.
Question 17, Joe.
Thank you, Chair.
Chair - 4:18:30
Cllr Joe Harris - 4:18:31
With a staggering 3 ,844 potholes currently waiting for repair and tens of thousands more
being filled each year, it's clear that Gloucestershire's roads are in a dire state.
Yet despite this crisis, residents are expected to pay even higher council tax bills, up nearly
5 % again this next year.
How does the how does the council explain this growing backlog of dangerous road defects when taxpayers are forking out more than ever?
our residents simply
Expected to accept that no matter how much they pay the roads will just keep getting worse
Yeah
Peter the council. Well, I've repeat large amounts of the answer to
Chair - 4:19:15
the last question. We are fixing more potholes
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:19:16
We have looked at changing the technology. We've looked at changing the practices
It was referenced earlier that we don't fix the pothole next to it
We do unless there is urgent reason why they can't we have made a huge progress in our transformation program
To continue to do that we have I'm guessing this number. So somebody please don't quote me think over 3 ,000 miles of roads
It will remain a challenge, but we are up to that challenge and we're making steps to do it better
Question 18. Thank you, sir
Chair - 4:19:48
Cllr Joe Harris - 4:19:49
For nearly two decades, Gloucestershire's residents have watched bus services disappear,
leaving many, especially those in rural areas, stranded without reliable transport.
Yet when asked a straightforward question about how many bus trips have been cut since 2005,
the council is unable or unwilling to provide a clear answer.
If the council is so confident in its strong bus network and investment strategy,
Why can't it be transparent about the scale of service reductions?
And how does it justify forcing residents to pay ever increasing council tax while their access to essential transport?
continues to shrink
Chair - 4:20:28
So as you know, we don't run the buses so we don't know which ones necessary
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:20:30
We do not have the data of every single one that doesn't run and therefore we do not have that information
But we do subsidize many of the routes and we do if you'd ask question how many?
We have maintained you would get a different answer. We've also introduced additional bus support with the Robin scheme
Thank you question 19 Joe
Question 20
Chair - 4:20:53
2021
Chancellor hey Colin. Do you have a supplementary please? Yes, I do and
Cllr Colin Hay - 4:21:02
It refers to the answer on question 14 above where you find
Utilities do you find?
Ringway for leaving signs lying around and if so, how much is that?
The other thing is and that would really sharpen their their attitude to leaving signs
abandoned all over the place and
In that I also want to make a comment that you're saying well if people see signs
Lying around they should send it back or get in touch through fix my street
Actually, no the contractor should pick them up I said before it's simple
You count the number of signs going out and you count them back in. Why is that so difficult?
I know that on the
The 417 going out to science tests. There's still I think although I haven't been there for a week or two
There's still signs saying no no road markings
There are it's complete
They've been there for months.
Count them out, count them back in.
What is so difficult with that?
I'm not sure where the question went with that.
Chair - 4:22:19
Cllr Colin Hay - 4:22:20
It was fines for ring way.
So that might be counterproductive
to cost ourselves extra money,
but I will look into how we monitor that and action on that.
I have to say in my area,
And I again wonder why this is so difficult if I know because we all know where there's work done in our area
Mine's quite large. Um
Email to the highways manager confirms whoever something should be moved or not moved and resolved
Why should we have to do that? It should be the contract. Sorry pencil 22
Chair - 4:22:52
Cllr Colin Hay - 4:22:57
This question Linda actually you've answered a work that is currently being done I
I think what I want to know is
Why are we two years behind these mitigations?
They've been put in place in other councils in the southwest
That's why the auditor decided to highlight it in this year's audit report
That this council was two years behind many of the others in the southwest with these mitigations
Well, thank you. It's a pretty good question that you you're in a
Cllr Lynden Stowe - 4:23:34
pretty good position to ask
Oh, you know the new auditors
You know, why?
Would we not have been flagged up as a council with this as a risk by our previous auditors who I believe were grand Thornton
So that would be a pretty good question to ask them
I mean then given your position as previously both on overview and scrutiny management and as chair of
Audit it's exactly the sort of thing that you should be picking up in that role to some extent
You know the role of audit is one that is checked and challenged within our committee structure not by me as a
Portfolio holder during that period of time so I think you know that dialogue needs to be had
I'm sure officers will be having that dialogue, but it's one that I think should be led from your your scrutiny position. Thank you
I
Can't say hey, yeah, so 23 no
24
Chair - 4:24:29
25
Council Willingham, do you have a supplementary please?
Not 25 but to 26 chair
Cllr David Willingham - 4:24:39
So I'm told by taxi drivers in childhood that such a mess has been made post resurfacing
Reinstatement of the lines by this administration that the parking restrictions are currently unenforceable
How did this happen?
Why is it taking so long to fix and is the council going to apologize to blue badge holders and taxi drivers for this?
Fiasco that's just I don't understand how you can get something this badly wrong and take this long to fix it
I
Think we can't dispute on the definition of badly wrong
Chair - 4:25:18
But there is a recognition that some issues have been raised and we
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:25:19
will we addressing those
Question 27 councillor Brown David you have a supplementary
Chair - 4:25:27
Cllr David Brown - 4:25:31
Yes, thank you chair on the basis that build back better may continue in some form or fashion
I will do
Thank you mark for your answer. I do note that the
upkeep of
A build better project is usually held by the owner of the equipment
but with the future costs of
pads for defibrillators costing upwards of 90 pounds and
Batteries costing in excess of 400 pounds that is putting off quite a few
community organizations
but I know it in your I
Do know that there are some of these devices mounted
adjacent to
lampposts and I'm wondering if that makes
highways owners and
beneficiaries of build back better in any case, can you tell me if
Highways have been able to use build back better for this purpose. I can confirm that
My bill back better funding is all
almost all allocated
Chair - 4:26:44
I'm not sure the answer. I'm pretty honest on the specifics around
Cllr Mark Hawthorne - 4:26:48
lampposts
And it's not unusual for lampposts to be described as some form of powering something else
I think we have the same conversation about EV charges not that long ago
and if from a technical point of view it turned out to be very very different.
And I guess the one thing that's very similar about EV chargers and
defibrillators is they do require a lot of power because effectively though they
are discharging power as part of their operation. But you know the guys here are
listening in and they will take that challenge away. On your issue about
ongoing maintenance, I genuinely think that's quite a difficult one for me to
give a definitive answer.
Because it's brilliant that you're using your bill back
better to put these facilities in place.
But if everyone did that, then there
would be an ongoing liability.
And how do we quantify what that ongoing liability is?
And how do we build it into a budget?
So I think it's possibly something
that we might want to look at, maybe building
some extra funding into the original rewards,
so it has some sort of two or three years
maintenance built into it.
But we can certainly get the team to go away and have a bit of a think about that.
Thank you, Mark.
Question 28, Suzanne Williams.
Suzanne, do you offer supplementary?
Chair - 4:28:07
No?
OK, 29, Alex.
Alex, do you have a supplementary, please?
I do, Chair.
Thank you very much.
Cllr Alex Hegenbarth - 4:28:20
Thank the leader for his answer and his offer to continue this conversation inside the meeting
as well.
Ultimately while yes, it's not overall a responsibility for GCC
There are significant elements of the project that do fall under GT GCC's responsibility
The main problem is is about making sure there are regular meetings and communications between stakeholders to move this project forward
It's been stalled for 10 years
Yes, the developer has a large part to play in that but at no point
It seems to be that GCC is taking the reins of moving this project forward
Even chairing a liaison group between stakeholders would be a start but that doesn't seem to be happening
And meeting seems to be ad hoc and seems to be frequently cancelled. So the meeting I referred to here of
Myself and other officers meeting with history again. That was the GCC officers weren't available for that meeting
But they said we've got another meeting coming up in a few days time that then some sort of you got cancelled
I don't think there's been another meeting since so what I would like
Publicly for you to say is yes
GCC will be taking
Responsibility before ensuring the project moves forward. I'm not going to hold you down on what that specifically means
But there needs to be some kind of leadership here because all this answer is
of all due respect, is people pointing fingers
at each other about, well it's not our response
to it, it's someone else.
And I'll be honest, myself and my residents do not care.
We just want it fixed.
Thank you.
You were doing well there.
Then you used the word responsibility,
which made me judder.
Chair - 4:29:56
Cllr Alex Hegenbarth - 4:29:57
I actually agree with you, and I also agree
that one of our strengths is we can convene those meetings
and pull them together.
Can we own and guarantee to fix the problem,
which is what responsibility says?
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:30:09
Probably not but can we make a leadership on it? Yes, and you have my commitment that meeting will go ahead
Thank you leader question 30 Alex have a supplementary I do thank you
Chair - 4:30:21
I'm gonna use that word responsibility again
Cllr Alex Hegenbarth - 4:30:22
Thank you for your answer. It's great to see that Linwood Road is on the schedule
The main problem with this is the amount of utilities and like that are underneath the surface
It's white that can keeps getting kicked down the pothole groans
regarding this
It's always seen as there's too much money or there are quicker wins or other things and that's that's fine in a very short -term
Basis, but there's been several years since major works were done on this
There had been I went down there with residents and highways manager to look at certain sections. There was a look at potentially doing
Sections of a patchwork of it, but then that got abandoned they said oh wow
There's utility and it's gonna be too much money. We need to do so. Thank you for a
a timid commitment that it will be for July I do understand your point of yes, it's subject to other factors and changes and such
however that
Constantly gets used to residents to say well there are other factors under play. So
As I'm sure you're completely 100 % confident. You'll come back as council leader after me
I'd like you to make a firm iron commitment to the fact that this road will get resurfaced because
If you're not here, it doesn't matter and the next leader will pick it up. But ultimately if you are we've got your assurance
Chair - 4:31:46
Alex I'm grateful for your confidence. I'm in the output of the
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:31:47
election. I never predict elections in advance and
You have it in the answer. The road is on the schedule to be resurfaced
It would be and I think the answer also states
July is the target, you know, we are currently in what late February
There is still a bit of winter to come and maybe impacts on that
I wouldn't well, I couldn't give you a guarantee will be July but it is on the list. It will be done
Thank You leader next question 31 Linda Cohen Linda
Chair - 4:32:18
Yes, thank you and thank you for requesting the meeting with South gloss
Cllr Linda Cohen - 4:32:22
How long are you going to wait for them to come back before you chase them again and confirm the date?
Thank you for the supplementary question. We won't wait long. We've
Cllr David Gray - 4:32:35
asked on multiple occasions the the kicker
I think in terms of the being an opportunity for a change and I absolutely empathize with the local residents about how logical is
That we have this HRC site clearly much more
Contiguous with where they live and therefore it's logical that that's that should be something they use
There is an opportunity because in March they are following our example of the very successful
booking system which manages the flows and maximises the ability to run the HRC.
They are introducing a booking system in that site.
So I hope when we talk to them, when we have that meeting that we've asked for, and we
will keep asking until we get the meeting, we'll make the point, you know, what is it
that is the blocker for them?
Is it capacity? Because if they have capacity, then we should have a conversation about how
we use that capacity, we being the wider community, to do the right thing, which is clearly that
there should be access. We have those arrangements with other authorities, so it's unfortunate
that they're a holdout in terms of refusing access in the past.
Thank you. Linda, do you have a supplementary 32?
No, I don't. Thank you
Chair - 4:33:47
Cllr Linda Cohen - 4:33:49
Roger 33
Chair - 4:33:54
Cllr Roger Whyborn - 4:33:58
I'm pleased to note that there is going to be a review of the speed on
This particular road. I would I would ask if you are prepared to put some urgency to this and also to
other a roads around the county
we and the reason I'm asking that question is that
We've already this year had one serious fatality on the road albeit not one that would be helped by reducing
the speed limit from
40 to 30
in that particular case and
We have other roads where
All around the county where we're very much aware. I think anecdotally and
and in general terms from what from studies that have been done, but
Major cause of accidents is speed and areas where
Reducting speed would really help us. So I am going to ask that
Are you able to give some time scale on this and some urgency to it, please?
Chair - 4:35:03
I'm not going to give that to you now because I can't need to talk to officers
Cllr Roger Whyborn - 4:35:04
But I please you brought the point out about the speed across the county on many of our roads
Cllr Dave Norman - 4:35:12
Where it is too fast and I'm also interested that you actually sat on the recent cabinet panel
the cross -party cabinet panel where we were talking about a lots of issues that need to be
considered in our
Road safety policy which is a live document and you're signed up to all those recommendations
Which were a cross -party support which is absolutely fantastic
So anything that's brought up in respect of road safety by colleagues on your side of the chamber
I hope you would give them a briefing on what was decided in that cabinet panel because I would say that is your role
Having sat on there representing your group
Thank you for that councilor. Roger do you have a supplementary to 34?
Thank you for that Roger
Chair - 4:36:01
Chair - 4:36:06
35 Rebecca's not here 36 job Councillor Mosley. Do you have a supplement? Yes, I do. Thank you
Thank you for your answer council Norman
Cllr Gill Moseley - 4:36:14
You state that you are aware of the positive effect of the 20 mile an hour speed limits on road safety
We're all aware that for instance the Sun rises every day, but we can't do much about that
We are also aware of the rising RTI's and already they are far too high a level as we know in Gloucestershire
So there is something that we could do about this and that is by introducing 20 mile an hour speed limits.
My question is what measures has the cabinet member taken to shake off the complacency of the Conservative administration with regard to 20 mile an hour limits
and to reach out to those communities such as Dimmock in my division that clearly wants them. Thank you.
I
Cllr Dave Norman - 4:37:02
Think I'll start with what I just said at the end of my last answer to your
colleague on that side of the chamber
Speed is an issue across the county and whether we're talking about
Higher speed roads or roads that are lower and could be further lowered
Yes, that is going to contribute to an improvement in the statistics, but it cannot be done as a blanket
It's about the process of like dimmer parish council through your good self
Entering into the process of making an application to see if that road would fit but there are far more
serious
Areas of our County well, we've got some very very high statistics
About killed and seriously injured on roads. Normally that a single carriageway with a 60 mile an hour speed limit
We've got to look at all of the roads
We've got to make a move on speed where it can be reduced where it has the support of the community
And I will look with officers at that and again
Talk to your colleague in the row in front of you on the outcome of the most recent cabinet panel
Thank you for Dave question 37 councillor Hodgkinson Paul, do you have a supplementary? Yes, I do. Thank you
Chair - 4:38:16
So to the leader
Cllr Paul Hodgkinson - 4:38:19
My question was about what Sir Geoffrey Clifton Brown had said as the chair of the Public Accounts Committee at
Westminster he said that
Local roads are a national embarrassment
He also said that asked the state of our local roads is on the downslope
You said in your answer that local roads are improving. So who's right you or him?
Well, both obviously. Far be it for me to disagree with Sir Jeffrey. I
Chair - 4:38:51
think we know
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:38:52
that roads are a challenge. I think the, and we spent a lot of today talking about that,
is are we doing a good job and a better job? Yes. Are they getting better? The statistics
and evidence is there. So I think we could be both right on this occasion.
Question 38. Paul, do you have a supplementary? Yes, I do. So this is really about an ash
Chair - 4:39:16
Cllr Paul Hodgkinson - 4:39:17
dieback, isn't it? So I mean, David, from your answer, I have to say that there's no
evidence that I can see of any ash trees being left in the areas in the Cotswolds that I've
seen where they've been felled. In other words, none are left. They are all felled. So can
give me some examples therefore of those places in the Cotswolds where ash trees
have been left after others have been felled? I can't you know that's a an
extra question that I haven't got the information for so we'll have to
Cllr David Gray - 4:39:48
go away
and look at providing that out of you but we're always going to be driven by
safety first so we have those special that are our big you have a cultural
agricultural officers who look at the health of the trees.
We're not in the business of pulling out healthy trees.
And there is, indeed, you may have seen in the press,
there is some indication that actually there's a level
of resistance being starting to be seen
in some of the ash population.
So we do need to be careful about which trees
we're pulling out and only pulling out the ones
that either are already dead or are infected and will die.
So we're always going to be careful about that.
I will take the question about can we provide examples of where we've left some if we've
been too diligent in removing them on safety grounds.
I think that that's understandable if we believe that those trees are infected but I will look
into the specifics of whether there are any examples where we've the officers have identified
healthy trees and they've been left in a population of ones that have died.
Thank you.
39 port the answer commentary. Yes. So I mean, thank you. I look
Chair - 4:41:01
forward to that answer
Cllr Paul Hodgkinson - 4:41:02
I mean you may not be able to answer this one, but you know, who knows?
You've talked about six thousand
Actuaries being replaced how many of those six thousand have been planted along the a429 cross way
between siren sester and stove
Much as I like that stretch of road. I haven't counted
Cllr David Gray - 4:41:25
So, again, we'll come back with more detail.
But the fundamental principle of we're replacing two for one.
Now, many of the original trees would have been
self -seeded, so they would have been in places where
we wouldn't plant them now because we know, well,
once the tree is mature, we're going to have
problems with the positioning of those trees.
So it's not the case that we will replant.
It's clearly not the case that we will always replant
in exactly the same area.
I tend to look at it more in that broader context of we're putting in hundreds of thousands
of trees.
We put in half a million trees in the course of our tree planting campaign, halfway towards
our one million tree target.
But on the specifics, we'll come back to you about that specific road and I can give you
the information as to whether any have been planted in that particular location.
And if not, why not?
Thank you question 40 is councillor Fisher Bernie Java supplementary,
Chair - 4:42:24
please I do indeed
Thank you for your reply
Cllr Bernard Fisher - 4:42:29
You said to me a few months ago
That without the 80 million from the developers
Junction 10 wouldn't happen
Can you assure me that you have got the 80 million from the developers?
Conversations continue with developers.
The logic is overwhelming though,
Cllr David Gray - 4:42:51
in terms of what the 80 million does
in terms of the uplift coming from Junction 10
in the number of houses that will be able to be developed
in the area and all the employment land, et cetera.
So I am confident that we will get to some number
that will allow us to progress the scheme.
Of course the scheme is under DCO.
We're expecting the results of that to come out,
But it's such a good scheme in terms of what it will
deliver for Cheltenham.
And I understand Cheltenham have their financial
problems, that's liberal government for we've.
They have their problems so they're under particular
financial strain as the liberal Democrat run
organizations tend to be.
But I hope that they see the logic that going and you've
been talking about investment.
This is about people that the landowners in those
areas, the developers in those areas making a
contribution which will be significantly repaid in
in terms of the uplift in the developable value of the plots that they own.
I'll take that as a no then.
Cllr Bernard Fisher - 4:43:54
You can take it as a no, but it wasn't a no.
Chair - 4:43:57
Question 42, Councillor Willingham.
David, do you have a supplementary?
Yeah, thanks, Chair.
Cllr David Willingham - 4:44:06
I was sat in a cabinet meeting where one of your colleagues said that the data and intelligence,
in a report at least, said data and intelligence were a key asset of the
organization for driving improvement. I'm not sure that it's good news when data
that's most decade out of date is being presented to the public. So can we get an
investigation to find out what's gone wrong between highways and IT because if
If people look at these systems and are saying
that their drain hasn't been cleaned for almost a decade,
it doesn't really reflect very well
and it might lead to more questions.
I'm not sure where you get there for nearly a decade
because it was on a two -yearly schedule
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:44:54
and actually now it's on an annual schedule.
Yes, you're absolutely right, actually.
Data is one of those things we have to get right
and we spent a lot of time and effort
and continue to do that and I'm glad you applaud that.
It's interesting that when we looked at the budget just now we added money for flood alleviation and one of the three brackets we put
In was gully cleaning because we have stepped up gully cleaning to annual but in some areas it may need even more than that
Question 43 Alex Hagenboth Alex
Chair - 4:45:25
44
Question Paul bake cancel a bakehead port ever supplementary. Thank you. Thank you David
Cllr Paul Baker - 4:45:35
This question relates to a statement from Dale Vince that the county could be self -sufficient using wind generated electricity
I
Note your response, but clearly the County Council has a huge responsibility in driving economic growth across the county
indeed we have a local growth plan and a section of that growth plan refers to energy and
Talks about building on opportunities for energy generation and enablers
So surely on the back of that we really should be as a County Council
engaging with people like Delvince
About the prospect of generating cheap energy in our County
So he hasn't responded to the third part of my question
Which was can we get a presentation to the appropriate scrutiny committee?
So I really think it's important that we do that so that we understand the opportunities that are available to us
Thank you for the supplement.
Cllr David Gray - 4:46:33
I think again you need to see the energy situation in the round.
We're not the local planning authority when it comes to installation of wind turbines
and Mr Vince is more than entitled to try and sell his wares to any part of our county,
local government included.
But for now, the focus that we've had in terms of our own commitment to zero carbon, we're
installing solar panels.
We've got solar panels here.
We've got solar panels on Gloucestershire Magistrates.
There's a whole bunch of places where we're installing solar panels.
We just heard about the plan to replace the heating system in Shire Hall and make it zero
carbon.
So there's lots and lots of things.
Because we're, in terms of that growth plan, we're committed to nuclear as an authority,
supporting the plans around small nuclear modular reactors, which will be, central government
needs to, if they're really committed about zero carbon and they're committed about growth,
they need to pull their finger out in terms of getting these big game -changing technologies
underway and installed.
I'm always happy to meet with anybody to talk about and I think if it's going to help us to meet that zero carbon
But I don't see it as a principal responsibility of this council to be driving a wind turbines
I think that's that's something for private private industry because ultimately it's going to go on private land
Thank you David moving on because Rebecca isn't here question 49
Chair - 4:48:16
David Willie David you have a supplementary to your 49 question
Cllr David Willingham - 4:48:24
Just really well to say thank you for the answer. I'm glad that our bus RTI will be coming
Would it be possible at some point potentially later to just get an idea of what locations on the a route are
scheduled to get the RTI and which ones are likely to
Take the longer because of the bus shelter upgrades that needed don't need an answer now, but I think it would be useful to
inform people
What's happening with the buses because as as I'm sure you remember the people of st. Mark's
Do find that the bus is quite
Important to them. I know that was the our bus and the or the f bus but getting that information is
important to local people
Thank you for that question. Yeah, so two bits the answer one is that
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:49:16
we will have the paper coming to cabinet on the B
CIP funding which will have some more detail if you want to get in specific detail at that level
I think probably we need to arrange a meeting after that's been published with yourself and Tom name
Thank you for that leader question 50 David you have a supplementary
Chair - 4:49:34
no a pass or the rest things. Thank you
We can't have 50
52 kind of slip around David. Do you have a supplementary to 52?
Cllr David Brown - 4:49:51
Just to say I'm very much encouraged by the answer Linda, thank you very much and
Thank you for taking this important step
Do you have a supplementary to 53
Chair - 4:50:03
No 54
No
No
Thank You David
55 cancer called you have a supplementary 55. Yes
Cllr Paul Hodgkinson - 4:50:21
Thank you. Yeah, as you heard Steven as you heard earlier from two
residents
Near Borton on the a436. They are very very concerned about
What's happening with the existing trees and down there a hundred?
Fell before Christmas and another two fell in the last few weeks
I went down and had a look myself and I'm really really concerned. I'm very concerned about the risk
So I'm really push putting it to you again
That we need action now not tomorrow not next month not April
but now
To minimize the risk not only to residents to people driving along there or cycling or walking and also to the residents properties as well
So I'm really looking for you today to commit to really pushing the landowner to get this sorted, please
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:51:13
As you heard in the answer I gave earlier yes, and actually well we've been sitting in over lunch
I have asked for completely to break down and timescales, you know
And I know that there are limitations on our powers and actions
We have to step through before we get there and if we can get agreement it will be easier and quicker
But we will not wait forever. Thank you
Thank You leader 56 Paul
Chair - 4:51:34
Never supplementary to 56
Okay. Thank you
57 back to yourself councillor William David you have supplementary. Yeah. Thank you chair
Cllr David Willingham - 4:51:48
So this this planning application is one that obviously vexes quite a lot of people
I know a good number of the schools in and around the area have objected to
McDonald's and it's certainly something that's causing me casework. What I would
like to ask is if the council was unable to secure mitigations can I get an
assurance that we will look to act unilaterally for example with speed
limits and potentially an experimental traffic regulation order to ensure road
Safety and also to tackle potential congestion that will be
caused at this site by predominantly by vehicles turning right into or out out of the premises I
Am being credibly careful how I answer this question because first of all
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:52:40
This is a Cheltenham Borough Council decision and it would be absolutely wrong for me to say anything that might influence that secondly
Highways will submit a response and again
It would be absolutely wrong for me to tell them what that response should be
it should be based on the data and the planning law and I
Will concede though that depending on what the outcome is we should continue to review whether they need to be traffic improvements
Thank you leader
Chair - 4:53:12
I'll just accept this last one 58 Suzanne. Well, do you want to ask no?
Right, that's it then. Thank you members that ends
Chair - 4:53:25
Moving on to item 10, scrutiny.

10 Scrutiny

Scrutiny committee chairs to answer any questions on the activity detailed within the report.
Chairs are here of the committees at the time of the meetings.
What I'll do is I'll take it on block.
Members have any questions for any of the chairs?
Members?
Councillor Hilton.
Yeah, yeah, thank you chair just wanted to make an announcement as the
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:53:56
chair of the fire scrutiny committee
That we've added an additional
Meeting for 21st of March because the 7th of March meeting will hold a special
session to consider evidence on the proposed new firefighter shift patterns. Members will
remember that there was a calling on this. So we'll be getting presentations from the
chief fire officer, from the fire brigade's union and from firefighters. This meeting
will be held in private session and then we will report back in open session at the next
Meeting which is on the 21st of March so
Useful to make sure that everybody get a full attendance of the members for that and also for the second one
Okay, thank you for that
Chair - 4:54:51
Cllr Jeremy Hilton - 4:54:52
Jeremy though it is questions to the chairs
Chair - 4:54:53
but
Yeah, Julie noted so it is questions to the chairs, please members councilor of ours
I'd just like to make a statement following on from the council president question to my colleagues over here
seat34* - 4:55:08
Whatever I've already just very quickly. It's an update on the report
Chair - 4:55:12
I brought to council last time on the council wait list one of the recommendations was that we would meet with Gloucester MPs
And so it's arranged for a comfortable host concern and David drew and
seat34* - 4:55:22
myself to start meeting them next week
We will be raising the issue of council wait times
We will be raising with the MPs ambulance response time and this disparity between urban and areas and I personally
Will be pushing for us to to also meet with where's treating that we've been trying to contact since last summer
And we still haven't a date haven't had it been given a date for a meeting with him. So
Thank you for your patience chair
Okay for that Andrew
Chair - 4:55:50
Any questions for any of the chairs members council William?
Chair - 4:55:54
I would just like to ask and it may not be may be something that we're
Cllr David Willingham - 4:55:59
not able
to discuss but for the police and crime panel do we have any updates on what's
happening with the the disciplinary action in regards of very senior
officers and also the the ongoing payment of people who are not who are
Effectively suspended and working elsewhere. It may be that you can't answer that because it's subdue to see all that type of matter
But I think it will be a matter that concerns the public about the leadership of policing in Gloucestershire
Yes, okay
Chair - 4:56:38
Okay, so Robertson, yeah, I can answer I'll try to answer that one David
Cllr Steve Robinson - 4:56:43
the
suspension
It's been in the press regarding the suspension of the current Chief Constable and that, you
know, unfortunately we're having to pay his salary as well as the temporary one.
I have asked the Police and Crime Commissioner to actually include it in his next report
that he demonstrates to us the reason why, and I understand the reason why
because he's explained it to me, but the reason why we have to continue to pay
both the temporary and Rod Hanson. The second one was over the amount of
suspensions or those that are working on, you know, the jobs at the moment. Again, I
I've asked the police and crime commissioner because I understand it is quite a large number and for a small force
Why have we got and why are people having to wait so long to be investigated?
I've asked him to include that in his report as well because I've been contacted by other panel members
Cllr David Willingham - 4:58:02
Thank you very much, thank you. Thank you any other questions members
Chair - 4:58:03
chairs
No
Thank you. So moving on to item 11

11 Constitution Committee

Constitution committee I'll hand over to the leader councillor Davis for the report
Thank You chair
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:58:22
I'm going to be brief not just due to the lateness of the app for the complexity of the subject
But we did meet on the 20th January and we resolved to recommend some changes
To the council constitution that outlined in the appendix and very helpfully highlighted in red. So, you know what the changes were
It was also recommended
That council have to approve the amendments in terms of the reference of the regulatory committees detailed in appendix one of the report
You are welcome to ask detailed and complicated questions because Rob is here in the room to answer them
Thank you for that leader
So moving along item 12
Chair - 4:59:00
How do we have to vote on our guy here report
Okay, I do apologize later they have
Okay, so any questions first answer leader
So can we have a show of hands please those in support?
That's unanimous, as I can see.
Thank you, members.
So moving on to Item 12, appointments committee.
Again, back to you, Councillor Davis, to present the report and recommendation.

12 Appointments Committee

It says the Council will need to vote for the appointment.
Thank you.
Thank you, Chair.
And I know we are getting towards the end of the meeting, but this is
Cllr Stephen Davies - 4:59:44
an incredibly
important topic and an incredibly important decision that this has been taken.
Outlined in the report, you will see the further process that we went through.
And one of the things that was important to me is that that was completely cross -party.
It needed to be so in the light of the imminence of the election, but actually it probably
always should be.
And I want to thank all of those involved, both the group leaders who got involved in
process, but also all of the staff.
We had external bodies come in, into panels, and a huge amount of work was done, and I
thank them for that.
We had a good lot of applicants at the very beginning of the process, and I would like
to thank them for the work they put in.
But on the final day, we whittled it down to three who were all considered appointable
to the role, and that's, you know, is an important measure of the success of the candidates in
this process.
I am happy to propose that there was a unanimous decision to appoint Joe Walker as our next chief executive
And we do need to put that to a voters council and I look for your support in that
Chair - 5:00:59
Yes, right so members could have a show of hands to that recommendation, please
That's unanimously carried. Thank you members. Thank you

13 Pension Fund Annual Report for 2023-24

Final one I have here today is item 13 pensions fund annual report
for 23 24
Councillor hate to present councillor. Hey Colin
Thank you very much if you go to the page
at the beginning of this.
Cllr Colin Hay - 5:01:32
I guess not many people have gone through every page.
But just looking at the front page,
you'll see the new livery of the pension fund.
It's been recommended that the pension fund
does distance itself from Gloucester County Council.
Gloucester County Council does administer the fund,
but for various reasons.
Because there are 251, I think,
employers in the scheme and it does need to stay apart and so and I've
I've been well encouraged by what that the new livery and everything else is
the pension fund report is a statutory obligation has to come here I've got
some things to say on this I will try and keep it as brief as I can I think
there's some things which are really worth noting. So it's actually, sorry I
just said 251, 241 employers instead of the 222 last year and membership has
has increased. The number of members in the fund is now 60 ,899.
need one more. The value of the fund, which I think is quite important, is
currently standing at 3 .421 billion pounds. It's a decent sum of money and
that's gone up by 363 million this last year. And we are, the fund is positioned
in the top third of local government pension scheme funds and has achieved a 7 .5 % annualized
return.
It's all good.
And just going back, and you'll notice in the livery, it's all nice and green and sweet
and nice.
And I thank all the members of the pension fund in the moves that we've been making to
decarbonize as much as possible our fund.
And not only that, Brunel, our fund partners,
are at the forefront of decarbonizing our investments
and so on.
And in fact, quite recently, Brunel
signed the accord, which is the climate stewardship
expectations.
So that Brunel is expecting our fund managers to actually be our to look and check
Where those investments are and to make sure that they're reporting back
Exactly what's going on in terms of carbon and other and other matters and we also are a signatory
but if you look at the moment on the website, it's not there because
It takes a few days
to be to be up there but when it is we'll be putting out a press release and
I you know I've taken the time at the end of a very long meeting and I do
apologize I think this is really good news it's really good news you know for
those people on the pension fund it's really good news for our members that
they know that their money is not contributing to climate change and it's
It's good for our employers as well because we're doing okay and contribution rates are
going likely to be coming down, well they are, they've said that they're coming down
next year.
So it's a good news story and I'm sorry to have taken these extra few minutes to tell
you about the good news that's happening in the pension fund.
Thank you.
Thank you for that comment.
duly noted, Council meeting to a close. Thank you.